A Trail by Any Other Name . . .?

What trail sticks out in your memory as above or below its true grade?  For example, when first skiing Belleayre with the girls, I noticed that Roaring Brook, though marked as a blue, really could be a green in terms of skill level (beyond absolute beginner).

Particularly curious what folks think about Gore trails -- for example, I haven't skied it yet (planning to as soon as I can), but on YouTube videos Sagamore looks like a challenging blue, not a black (video can lie, of course).  And of course some parts of a trail can be more challenging than its overall marked grade indicates.

Petronio

Here are my examples:

Gore:
Sagamore:  Marked as black, should be blue.  Probably marked black because it used to be natural snow only and bumped up.
Pipeline:  Marked as blue, should be green.  A blue trail should NOT be one where you have to push with your poles to ski.
Pine Knot:  Marked as blue, should be black.  Icy, windswept, narrow, overcrowded, too steep for blue rating, double fall line.  I find it harder to ski than some blacks at places further south.
Sunway:  Marked as green, should be blue.  It skis way more like Wraparound at Windham or Belt Parkway at Hunter than any green I have been on and I don't think any beginner should try and learn on it.  Just mark it as blue and list it as "easiest way down".


Whiteface:
Paron's Run:  Marked as blue, should be black.  I find it harder than most trails at Hunter.  It really should be rated as a black to keep marginal skiers who shouldn't be there off the summit.
Victoria:  Marked as blue, should be black.  It is about the pitch of Eisenhower Drive at Hunter which I think is accurately rated black.
Skyward:  I have looked up the pitch of it and it is comparable to Clair's Way at Hunter and steeper than anything at Windham.  Should be double black especially if Paron's Run is changed to black as it is harder than Paron's Run.
Easy Street, Easy Way and Boreen:  Marked as green and should be blue.  They are of similar pitch to most of the West Peak trails at Windham which I think are accurately rated blue.  I don't think that anyone should be trying to learn on those if they are trying to learn.

Hunter:  
Jimmie Heuga Express:  Marked as black and should be blue.  It isn't steeper than Belt Parkway and marked a black.  I know that early season they sometimes leave the snowmaking whales on it, but when that happens just put a large "caution ungroomed terrain" or "expert only" sign on it.

Windham:
World Cup:  Marked as blue and should be black.  I find it harder than the other blacks on that peak.  It is narrow, icy, windswept, too steep to be a blue, and double fall line.

Hey Sno ! The thing about some of Gore's trails, Sunway etc is they are long. Some " beginners " simply don't have the leg strength for that distance. I've seen it happen several times. They did good on lower trails but wanted to go up farther. I warned them, they insisted and got into trouble.

Some beginners don't ski often enough to get their legs built up for those distances. WF, with it's beginner chairs gives them a rest, helps increase their on snow time. It's the best place for them to learn, IMO.

Sno, what did you think of the blue marking on the Wilmington Trail....BTW, your thread reminds me of that old WF sign...Some Mountains look at our blue trails and say that they are their blacks....thats ok, we looked at the greens and thought they were the parking lot.

Ski big or go home.

I hope MC gets some snow for you too.

The Wilmington Trail has been often closed 2 of the last 3 times I have been at The Face.  One of those times was early season as no one else was open on 12/3/11 during that crap winter.  The other time was my 2nd to last trip last year and it was done for the season by then.  I have only skied it like 4 times in my life, so I don't have enough experience with how it skis to really say anything about it.  The other trails I mentioned, I skied many more times, so I think I have enough knowledge to say what I think they should be rated as.

Anyone who has been to Whiteface even if only a few times would tell you that their trails are harder than trails rated the same at other places.  So someone who can ski a blue at another place should probably stick to the lower mountain at Whiteface till they develop their skills a bit more.

Black Hole @ Smuggs,

Triple Black?  Right place, timing is everything.  Late season, BIG snow, sliding for all you got. True no-fall zone.

Like Politics, all Trail Ratings are local.  Add in the conditions of the day, crew you're with and have at.

It's all just skiing.

Ski you on you favorite hill.

snoloco wrote

The Wilmington Trail has been often closed 2 of the last 3 times I have been at The Face.  One of those times was early season as no one else was open on 12/3/11 during that crap winter.  The other time was my 2nd to last trip last year and it was done for the season by then.  I have only skied it like 4 times in my life, so I don't have enough experience with how it skis to really say anything about it.  The other trails I mentioned, I skied many more times, so I think I have enough knowledge to say what I think they should be rated as.

Anyone who has been to Whiteface even if only a few times would tell you that their trails are harder than trails rated the same at other places.  So someone who can ski a blue at another place should probably stick to the lower mountain at Whiteface till they develop their skills a bit more.

Was Lookout Below open when you were there?

Grillman wrote

BTW, your thread reminds me of that old WF sign...Some Mountains look at our blue trails and say that they are their blacks....thats ok, we looked at the greens and thought they were the parking lot.

Ski big or go home.

Hanging in The Cottage, Lake Placid:

Definitely Victoria.  That is stepper than Skylark at Killington which is a black.  I see people walking back to connector all the time after looking over the edge.

Usually the term head wall is not associated with a green trail yet we have the Boreen Headwall which was a jump for the Women's DH in the Olympics.  Might be a black trail in the poconos.

64ER wrote

Like Politics, all Trail Ratings are local.  

Agreed, the ratings are relative against the other trails on the same hill. Not that they always get them right. Otherwise Okemo would only have blues.

Nice thread topic.  

A bit off topic,

I wish the T-parks would opt for a different code/color beside black or double black.     I understand why mountains use blacks, as I am sure many others do, however kids and even some adults often say....."I ski black(double black), so can do this trail/park".

I know we use orange too but its confusing for the mildly informed.    

Orange triangles?    one (beginner), two (intermediate), three (expert only--must have sign-off by mountain personnel)

I:)skiing wrote

I understand why mountains use blacks, as I am sure many others do, however kids and even some adults often say....."I ski black(double black), so can do this trail/park."

Do adults really do this? I know kids love to say "I skied a black" when they go through the terrain park, but I don't think adults are dumb enough to think that the black rating is due to pitch or conditions. And if they are that dumb, I don't think introducing an entirely new color and grading code will help the situation.

I just wish they had Mountain Hosts explain park etiquette to people who look hopelessly lost in there.

snoloco wrote

Here are my examples:

Gore:
.
Pipeline:  Marked as blue, should be green.  A blue trail should NOT be one where you have to push with your poles to ski.

Sometimes flat trails are marked blue because they lead to an area where once you get to a lift there are only blue, or blue and black trails. It keeps the beginner from getting in over their head

This is true in some cases, but Pipeline is flat as a pancake and dumps you onto Peaceful Valley, which is also a green.  You can also get to Pipeline on a green, so it really should be changed to a green.

Cedars on Burnt Ridge needs to stay a blue because it takes you to an area where there are only blues and blacks.

From Pipeline, you can't get back to Gore proper without skiing a blue (unless you take the shuttle bus).