Alternative Energy: Viable?

Office manager gave me this for my office today.

Stats on box: 65Watt equivalent, dimmable, soft white, lasts "22.8 years."  $10. I guess we will see.

22.8 years = 25k hours @ 3hrs/day which is how they rate them.
If you need dimmable- LED is a good choice, but they are $$$.
I still use incandescent where I want a dimmer and CFL for everything but specialty bulbs.

PeeTex wrote

Coach Z wrote

peetex Have you looked at the prices of led blubs lately?  They have come crashing down.  Home Depot has a two pack of 60w replacement blubs for under 5 bucks.  At that cost which will likely continue to go down the economics work.  

Harv while smal battery technology is improving its a whole different deal to talk about storing energy on a mass grid scale.

Had not seen that low a price before but on closer inspection, look at the life expectancy, only 10k hours which is about what you get with a CFL, you can get an 8 pack for $8.80. Snookered again. For LEDs I would buy Cree, their life expectancy is over 25k hours. Cree is the leader in LED technology.

Agree Cree blubs are better.  I have bought and sold Cree stock many times over the past 10 years but at this point this pricing is killing thier stock so I sold it probably for good.

Solar power to run ski lifts at ORDAs three resorts
July 29, 2015
By MATTHEW TURNER - Staff Writer Adirondack Daily Enterprise
           
LAKE PLACID - The Olympic Regional Development Authority plans to use solar energy in a big way.
ORDA entered into a 25-year power agreement with Borrego Solar, after approving a resolution Tuesday during its quarterly board meeting. The authority plans for an off-site solar field in Washington County to power ski lift and snowmaking operations for its three ski resorts at Whiteface Mountain Ski Center, Belleayre Mountain Ski Center and Gore Mountain Ski Center.

ORDA Chairman Pat Barrett said that over the life of the agreement, the ski center would reduce its carbon footprint, saying it would be like removing over "46,000 cars from the road." ORDA officials estimated that there would be an energy cost savings of $14 million, over the 25-year period.

Gore Mountain uses about 13 million kilowatt hours of power each year, a utility cost of approximately $1 million. The cost savings by switching to solar would cut that bill by $213,000 the first year, according to the governor's office.
"This new clear energy effort will reduce cost and continue to provide a high quality ski experience for New Yorkers and visitors from around the world," Gov. Andrew Cuomo wrote in the press release Tuesday.

It won't be "alternative energy" when oil is too expensive to waste it on all the shit we currently do.

PeeTex wrote

Giving up is not an option. This is a moon shot problem and we never made it to the moon by wasting a lot of resources on junk science - and today we have a lot of junk science. Universities and academics are not what they were 55 years ago when we started the space program. Everybody just wants to make a buck.

right, old fogies have been forecasting the end of civilization, or things were so much better x years ago since humans have been writing

maybe you were there and remember PT?

noip wrote

PeeTex wrote

Giving up is not an option. This is a moon shot problem and we never made it to the moon by wasting a lot of resources on junk science - and today we have a lot of junk science. Universities and academics are not what they were 55 years ago when we started the space program. Everybody just wants to make a buck.

right, old fogies have been forecasting the end of civilization, or things were so much better x years ago since humans have been writing

maybe you were there and remember PT?

I was there when my kids became mature enough to realize the old man wasn't as stupid as they thought he was and that my grandkids think their parents are idiots. I see you have not reached the maturity level of my kids yet. That's ok, I am a patient person.

OR if man was meant to fly God would have gave him wings.

If oil were a sustained $200 a barrel or fossil fuel in critical shortage, people would be screaming alternate energy's potential and it would be quickly built en masse.

Snowballs wrote

If oil were a sustained $200 a barrel or fossil fuel in critical shortage, people would be screaming alternate energy's potential and it would be quickly built en masse.

This is true.

Instead of planning ahead, as humans, we choose another strategy: wait until is a huge crisis and scramble, hoping it's not too late.

Snowballs wrote

If oil were a sustained $200 a barrel or fossil fuel in critical shortage, people would be screaming alternate energy's potential and it would be quickly built en masse.

Yes - people would be clamoring but the cost of solar would rise accordingly, where do you think the energy to run those semiconductor plants, mine the minerals and transport the materials comes from? Inflation would go ramped as the price of food and everything else goes up. The oil producers understand this. They have extremely complex economic models which they continuously run and refine that tells them where the sweet spot for the price of oil is. The last time I spoke to one of their economists back in 2009 he said the sweet spot was between $85 and $90/barrel. Clearly now they are not running on an economic model but have a political agenda. They want to stick it to Iran and Russia, because believe it or not, they want us around.

The Saudis are scarred crapless about one thing.  The U.S. Energy independence.  Fracking and shale oil were freaking them out and this drop in prices is an attempt to kill or slow it down.  They have been funding the anti fracking movement big time.  How ironic is it that the big green lobbies biggest cash is coming from Middle eastern oil?

Coach Z wrote

How ironic is it that the big green lobbies biggest cash is coming from Middle eastern oil?

All kinds of good shit happens for selfish reasons. Take what you get

Coach Z wrote

The Saudis are scarred crapless about one thing.  The U.S. Energy independence.  Fracking and shale oil were freaking them out and this drop in prices is an attempt to kill or slow it down.  They have been funding the anti fracking movement big time.  How ironic is it that the big green lobbies biggest cash is coming from Middle eastern oil?

Where the hell do you get this shit. Fracking and shale oil don't scare the Saudis, it's the Iranians and the Russians and most of all ISIS. They got politically fast and loose and lost control of their operatives. If it were Shale oil and Fracking they would run the price up another $20/barrel and still control that market. As far as Fracking goes - cut that shit out, that is a bigger environmental nightmare than another Chernobyl.

Well, don't know how true it is, but it's said that oil fracking fields will have a short production life and thus the Saudis are less concerned.

Side note, My hometown is in western Pennsylvania, where oil drilling began back in the day. Down there, you can smell crude in the woods as it seeps to the surface in places. Many people down there are now making big money letting their land be fracked. I've ridden quads deep into the woods in north central PA on state atv trails and  miles back into the woods there was a guy taking seismic readings from a large network of wire strung through the woods over long distances. They were all over the place.

It's been pretty well documented that the Suadis and Russians are financing the anti fracking movement.  Spend a few million on a movie and prevent new sources in the U.S. Is good business for them to keep prices low.  

http://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2014/12/21/opec-oil-price-gamble-fracking-us-energy-budget-revenue-column/20738305/

http://dailysignal.com/2012/09/28/matt-damons-anti-fracking-movie-financed-by-oil-rich-arab-nation/

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/cannes-video-hollywood-environmentalists-anti-706051

A little OT for the current discussion, but I have a question...

Coach I think in the past you mentioned that the cost of electricity was subsidized in or around Lake Placid.

Can you explain how this works or who is subsizing?

Lake Placid has a municipal electric system.  They collect less taxes than investor owned utilities and get NY Power Authority hydro power at lower than market prices.  The NYPA power is probably the bigger subsidy.

MM

Your sources are rather one dimensional in their simplistic reasoning for OPECs current market strategy. Typical of shallow right wing (lack of) thinkers. I believe that in fact we are in bed with the Saudis on this one. Although low oil prices hurt our current wild cat producers they don't hurt the big boys who control the refineries and they don't deplete our resources, we have survived many a down turn in the oil industry and because our economy is not a one trick poney and low pump prices are good politics than it actually helps us. Read this article for a more reasoned explanation for the current market situation:
http://oilprice.com/Energy/Oil-Prices/Did-The-Saudis-And-The-US-Collude-In-Dropping-Oil-Prices.html

This makes some good points.  At the same time they are taking out the higher cost oil sand and shale plays.  Many of these businesses will go out of business and defualt on debt so that when oil does go back up making the street will not be so willing to fund them again raising the cost of capital and lowering US and Canadian production long term.  

Both objectives get accomplished at the same time by the  Saudis.   Meanwhile these objectives also mesh with the green interests.  Thy enemies enemy is my friend.

When we were buying our home and looked at placed in Placid the real estate agent explained that from the Olympics Orda and LP had a 50 year deal to get way below market hydro electric.  Everyone in LP heats with electric because if this though it makes no sense elsewhere.  Several other people have told me the same thing so I take that as fact.  Can't find anything on it on the Internet.

My real estate agent was born in LP so I take what she told me on its face.