Boarder purposely takes out skier

gebbyfish wrote

I have my issues with snowboarders, but the video seems to support the kid that he did everything he could to avoid a collision and this kid came out of nowhere, from behind the dad.

The father slapping the kid is wrong (not that I wouldn't want to, but you just don't).  

That said, the snowboarder was totally at fault if you ask me.  Look how crowded the trail is.  His "average speed" was overtaking everybody on what was obviously a high traffic, probably beginner trail.  Girl in the green jacket that "cut him off" is clearly the downhill skier.  All she's doing is skiing, and bears no responsibility to look back up the hill before turning.  So the snowboarder is coming in too fast and was obviously not paying enough attention to anticipate that the girl who "cut him off" was turning.  He barely avoids taking her out, and then doesn't have enough control to turn to avoid the father and the boy that got taken out.  That kid didn't really 'come out of nowhere'.  He got taken out not more than a foot or two from his father, the kid being yet another downhill skier.  First impression is the snowboarder seems like a nice enough kid, but ultimately he takes no responsibility and says the kid should have stuck to the bunny hill.  That makes the snowboarder a d-bag punk if you ask me, one that has a lot to learn about the skier responsibility code.

The worst person in this is the father though, and not for slapping the punk.  What kind of father sees his kid get taken out like that, then skis PAST his fallen child to puff up his chest and slap the punk.  My first stop is at my son, to calm him and assess the possibility of injury.

campgottagopee wrote

OK, how would you react if your kid was taken out??

Camp, I would have chewed him a new A hole, but I would not have hit him. If any serious damage were done I would have called in Mountain management. It was a preventable accident, not an act of malice.

PeeTex wrote

campgottagopee wrote

OK, how would you react if your kid was taken out??

Camp, I would have chewed him a new A hole, but I would not have hit him. If any serious damage were done I would have called in Mountain management. It was a preventable accident, not an act of malice.

I would like to THINK I would do something similar to what you've mentioned. That said, I've never been in that situation (NEVER want to be either) so I honestly don't know how I would react, or what I would do. I consider myself a laid back person and not a lot bothers me......but safety of a loved one could cause me to lose my shit.

I had an interesting near miss at greek Saturday, the slopes were as crowded as I have ever seen them. I was cruising one of my favorite lines on the lower headwall under 5 at a pretty good clip. There was a little kid standing directly under the lift right at the base of the headwall (how/why? we'll never know...).  I saw him and had plenty of room to get by on my intended line skiers left so didn't really check my speed. what I didn't see was another skier standing in the middle of the headwall obscured by the lift tower as I came around, forcing me right towards the kid  not taking any chances I set ''er down and ended up pretty much baseball sliding right up to him - within inches. I think the lil guy shit his pants and I wasn't too far behind. Of course this is right under the lift and got a few nasty remarks about watching out for little kids etc from the peanut gallery above  nobody want to be THAT guy

After making sure he was ok the lil bugger asks me, are YOU ok?! which was pretty cute/funny so I give him a fist pump, brush myself off and head to the lift. The kids mom is by the liftline and sees the whole thing - asks if I'm ok and apologizes for the kid being there. I returned the apology and said I was at fault as well (per PT, the kid was the downhill skier..) and was just glad no one was hurt. this whole scenario could have had a million other outcomes, some not so good. bottom line -  shit happens, be careful out there...

Battery is no beuno, especially if they are under 18. Keep your cool parents, it's not worth it.

Now I did read that someone said that they have problem with snowboarders. You do understand that that is bigotry right? Lumping everyone in one group and hating them is ridiculously stupid. It's beyond ignorant and dumb. Grow up d-bag.

My worst collision experience ever was at Mt. Snow in 1990. I was a goofy 13 or so  year old kid doing laps down a ridiculously congested Exhibition all day long. Half was groomed and the other side was bumped. Not being as good as I thought I was the low angle bumps were awesome. I got side swiped by an adult skier, I fell over and slid right into someone else who fell on me breaking my nose. Standing right there was a ski patroller who then shamed me by telling me how I needed to ski in control. He wasn't nice at all, since I just had my bell rung I wasn't in a place to defend myself and I just took it. The adult skier split the scene without owning up to it. Should I hate on skiers for that? Obviously no, that would be dumb.

Hey, D bag, it was I who said they have issues with snowboarders.  

If you also read the posts, I was pretty much the only person who was defending this kid on here.  

My issues with snowboarders have been when I see them cut people off on the slope and then I hear them bragging about it to their friends!  

D bag!

For those who put it all on the snowboarder, I would like to know, if you are starting from a stopped, standing position, as this child and dad do in the video, is it not their responsibility to look uphill and yield?  

http://www.aasi.org/aasi2002/press_t.asp?mode=code 

gebbyfish wrote

Hey, D bag, it was I who said they have issues with snowboarders.  

If you also read the posts, I was pretty much the only person who was defending this kid on here.  

My issues with snowboarders have been when I see them cut people off on the slope and then I hear them bragging about it to their friends!  

D bag!

You are still throwing a whole recreational user group into one thing that you are saying you don't like. If that's not behaving like a bigot then I'm not sure what is.

Don't take the D-bag thing too personally, it's the internets and I don't actually know you.

And.....kisses. xxxx

raisingarizona wrote

gebbyfish wrote

Hey, D bag, it was I who said they have issues with snowboarders.  

If you also read the posts, I was pretty much the only person who was defending this kid on here.  

My issues with snowboarders have been when I see them cut people off on the slope and then I hear them bragging about it to their friends!  

D bag!

You are still throwing a whole recreational user group into one thing that you are saying you don't like. If that's not behaving like a bigot then I'm not sure what is.

Don't take the D-bag thing too personally, it's the internets and I don't actually know you.

And.....kisses. xxxx

"Have issues with".  

Check it out in Websters.  

Is that synonymous with "don't like"?  

I also have issues with cloudy days, Republicans, bad service at restaurants, etc.., but that does not mean that I do not accept that these things exist and have a right to be.  

and....hugs.  xoxo

gebbyfish wrote

raisingarizona wrote

gebbyfish wrote

Hey, D bag, it was I who said they have issues with snowboarders.  

If you also read the posts, I was pretty much the only person who was defending this kid on here.  

My issues with snowboarders have been when I see them cut people off on the slope and then I hear them bragging about it to their friends!  

D bag!

You are still throwing a whole recreational user group into one thing that you are saying you don't like. If that's not behaving like a bigot then I'm not sure what is.

Don't take the D-bag thing too personally, it's the internets and I don't actually know you.

And.....kisses. xxxx


"Have issues with".  

Check it out in Websters.  

Is that synonymous with "don't like"?  

I also have issues with cloudy days, Republicans, bad service at restaurants, etc.., but that does not mean that I do not accept that these things exist and have a right to be.  

and....hugs.  xoxo

I can respect that and thank you for the hugs. I like hugs. Sometimes even more than drugs. Except for on a powder day, I don't want your hugs while sharing that chair ride, I wanna smoke your weed!

campgottagopee wrote

PeeTex wrote

campgottagopee wrote

OK, how would you react if your kid was taken out??

Camp, I would have chewed him a new A hole, but I would not have hit him. If any serious damage were done I would have called in Mountain management. It was a preventable accident, not an act of malice.

I would like to THINK I would do something similar to what you've mentioned. That said, I've never been in that situation (NEVER want to be either) so I honestly don't know how I would react, or what I would do. I consider myself a laid back person and not a lot bothers me......but safety of a loved one could cause me to lose my shit.

I looked at it the same way.  I don't have kids, but I have been in a similar (but worse) situation while volunteering for the Special Olympics.  A skier (about the same age as the kid in the video) collided with an athlete that I was guiding during a warm-up run in our beginner area resulting in an injury.  The kid was a very capable skier.  The athlete was a 9 year old non-verbal autistic boy.  The kid was a complete disrespectful douche-bag.  I remember almost being in shock when it happened.  I could barely decipher what the kid was saying to me because he was dropping some many F-bombs.  The sad fact was that he wasn't the person who was injured.  It was the athlete.  His poor attitude made me laugh more than anything else.  Albeit, I would have gained some level of personal satisfaction from beating the living shit out of him, but that would have set a poor example (and could have gotten me thrown in jail).  

I gained much more satisfaction from discussing it with the kid's parents.  I find it interesting... some parents (these parents were no exception) are shocked by what their kids say and do when they are not around.  The kids parents were very good about it.  They were not at all defensive.  They were super disappointed in their child, and were very embarrassed by his disrespectful behavior.  The kid ended up losing his season pass.  I thought this was a bit lenient based on the fact that there were only 4 weeks left in the season when it happened.  I wanted him banned for the entire next season.

Common sense says that in a high-traffic scenario you slow down to almost a complete stop... especially in a beginner area.  The kid ("Kid" implies very little common sense) was going way too fast.  The rage-aholic dad acted like a complete jack-ass.  I don't think the kid on the snowboard intended to cause any harm.  The snowboarder's parents took it a bit too far calling in the local news to publicize the incident... We like to call parents like that attention whores.

gebbyfish wrote

For those who put it all on the snowboarder, I would like to know, if you are starting from a stopped, standing position, as this child and dad do in the video, is it not their responsibility to look uphill and yield?  

http://www.aasi.org/aasi2002/press_t.asp?mode=code

I figured someone would go there.    For starters, do you really think it's acceptable to ski/board with such lack of control that you go speeding by someone within two feet of where they are? The snowboarder should never have been going so fast on that crowded a trail such that he couldn't maintain enough control to avoid the father (stationary) by more than a foot or two.  Second, the little kid didn't come darting out or make a sudden entrance.  Yes, he may have been shielded by the father, but it looks like the kid was just a slowly moving skier coming across the trail in front of his father.  

Bottom line is, the snowboarder should have been more cognizant of his surroundings, the crowding on the trail, and the movement of downhill skiers......and slowed down.  If he realizes he is ripping through a beginner area and just slows down, the incident doesn't happen.

gorgonzola wrote

I had an interesting near miss at greek Saturday, the slopes were as crowded as I have ever seen them. I was cruising one of my favorite lines on the lower headwall under 5 at a pretty good clip. There was a little kid standing directly under the lift right at the base of the headwall (how/why? we'll never know...).  I saw him and had plenty of room to get by on my intended line skiers left so didn't really check my speed. what I didn't see was another skier standing in the middle of the headwall obscured by the lift tower as I came around, forcing me right towards the kid  not taking any chances I set ''er down and ended up pretty much baseball sliding right up to him - within inches. I think the lil guy shit his pants and I wasn't too far behind. Of course this is right under the lift and got a few nasty remarks about watching out for little kids etc from the peanut gallery above  nobody want to be THAT guy

That's pretty scary stuff

I like that headwall too

gorgonzola wrote

 

After making sure he was ok the lil bugger asks me, are YOU ok?! which was pretty cute/funny so I give him a fist pump, brush myself off and head to the lift. The kids mom is by the liftline and sees the whole thing - asks if I'm ok and apologizes for the kid being there. I returned the apology and said I was at fault as well (per PT, the kid was the downhill skier..) and was just glad no one was hurt. this whole scenario could have had a million other outcomes, some not so good. bottom line -  shit happens, be careful out there...

JTG4eva! wrote

gebbyfish wrote

For those who put it all on the snowboarder, I would like to know, if you are starting from a stopped, standing position, as this child and dad do in the video, is it not their responsibility to look uphill and yield?  

http://www.aasi.org/aasi2002/press_t.asp?mode=code

I figured someone would go there.    For starters, do you really think it's acceptable to ski/board with such lack of control that you go speeding by someone within two feet of where they are? The snowboarder should never have been going so fast on that crowded a trail such that he couldn't maintain enough control to avoid the father (stationary) by more than a foot or two.  Second, the little kid didn't come darting out or make a sudden entrance.  Yes, he may have been shielded by the father, but it looks like the kid was just a slowly moving skier coming across the trail in front of his father.  

Bottom line is, the snowboarder should have been more cognizant of his surroundings, the crowding on the trail, and the movement of downhill skiers......and slowed down.  If he realizes he is ripping through a beginner area and just slows down, the incident doesn't happen.

I don't know where you ski JTG, but I see snowboarders who are boarding much faster, with much less control than this young man in the video, on a regular basis.  Looking at all the skiers on that hill, in various stages of starting and stopping, it's clear that even if that is not the "bunny" hill, there are many beginners on that run and the kid would have been wise to stay off that run. to begin with.  I bet it will be a long time before he goes down that run again!

The way I see it, the reason he comes close to the dad and son, is he is trying to avoid the kid on the left, who doesn't look up hill and is rigid on their skis, skiing in to the middle of a very congested run.  I think about this every time I ski down to the Tannery lift at Gore, a wide fast trail and as I make my lazy esses down to the lift, I know that people regularly bomb down the run and I look uphill before I cross the trail to make sure no one is bombing it.  I shouldn't have to do that right?  I'm the downhill skier.  

I really have a hard time saying he is "ripping" on the video as I can't tell speed by a video.  To me it appears that to go any slower, he'd be walking.  My opinion is the incident doesn't happen if dad looks up hill and says, " hold on son, the trail is really congested and there's a boarder coming.  Let's wait till he goes by. " My 2 cents.

From what I could see in that video I think the boarder was at fault too. Downhill skier.

Reality is that at times trail are too crowded to do any real skiing and honor the code.  Still you got to do it.

It's also REALLY hard to maintain your cool when a ripping teenager or anyone clocks your kid.  I have to admit that Zelda and I are a bit of a menace when we do wide turns behind Neve to try to create a zone or absorb any OOC riders from behind. I guess on those crazy days we should go just go home.

Still can never imagine hitting anyone for anything other than an self defense in an intentional assault.

So, let me see if I've got this right.  The girl (not looking uphill before every change of direction, stiff on her skis, skiing in apparently the wrong place), the father (not stopping his fledgling skier's forward progress every two feet to look for out of control sliders), and the son (making slow progress across the hill) are all at fault.....as opposed to the snowboarder, whose level of control was insufficient such that he almost clipped the girl and the father, and plowed over the son?  All this on a beginner trail at the base of the mountain, the type of area that is often a slow skiing zone?

Guess we are just gonna have to agree to disagree on this one.

Was the snowboarder skiing the fastest I've seen a snowboarder board, ripping like a bat out of hell?  No, but even you admit he was going too fast for the conditions (which include skier traffic).  To say he was barely moving at a pace above a walk?  Well, he was certainly overtaking other skiers who were doing more than walking down the hill.

The boarder slows down, is more cognizant of what is going on around him, and respects the rights of the downhill skiers and this doesn't happen.  Period.  I really hope he learned something other than how to turn his own faults into TV time and a lawsuit!

I don't totally disagree with you on being cognizant of uphill skiers.  I do that myself knowing there might be people ripping down trails like Skyward faster than I am, so I look out.  I also always ran uphill interference for my kids when they were learning.  But to expect beginners who are just learning to do that?  They should be allowed to be beginners on a green circle, no?

Hey guys this is called "Target FIxation" and it is a fucked up trick that some peoples brain plays on them. Google it.

JTG4eva! wrote

  But to expect beginners who are just learning to do that?  They should be allowed to be beginners on a green circle, no?

 No. You wouldn't start driving your car down the road without looking to see if other cars are coming first. The same rules of the road apply here. Learning the rules of the road can be accomplished before you even put your equipment on to head out on the slopes. They should be learning to follow properly the rules right from the beginning. If they're not learning to look up hill before they start going on a beginers run, then they're not going to do it on a hard run.

Not disagreeing with you Bosco.  Every skier needs to learn the 'rules of the road'.  Great advice.  However, it doesn't appear to me that any of the parties involved in the incident were breaking those rules, other than the snowboarder.  Certainly not the girl who "cut him off".  Certainly not the father, who has a right to teach his kid on a beginner trail.  I don't even think the kid that got clipped, as he just seems to be coming across the trail, unfortunately shielded from site by his father.  If the boarder is going a more appropriate speed for the conditions and maintains adequate control, he isn't put in a position of almost clipping the girl, veering and almost clipping the father, and taking out the kid who was right by his father's side.