Clouds over Sunshine Village

Storm brewing in Sunshine Village inside Banff National Park.

Notice the story didn't make it here in Harvey Road and I thought this was an important story. It's been all over other forums and the news in Western Canada, but it's all about how you can screw up a ski area and the privilege few have.

I tried going to rundown of the situation in Ski Mad World.

http://madpatski.wordpress.com/2011/02/04/clouds-over-sunshine-village/

I've been following this in various places but hadn't kept up with the enormous amount of discussion on TGR.  

I can totally understand how this happened, and possibly even comprehend how management could do the wrong thing and fired people for actually enforcing resort policy.  What I can't understand is the refusal to back down.  There's just no upside and the farther it goes the harder it will be.

I've seen multiple posts where people expressed sentiment like... "there must be more to this story than meets the eye."  Maybe, but it's hard to believe with what is at stake, ownership wouldn't be pushing that story out if they had a leg to stand on.

If the story is exactly as it looks on the surface,  I wonder what the odds are on winning a suit like this. I also wonder how it has been working for SV in general. When management is that intransigent, it can't be fun.

One thing is sure, social networks have changed the PR game.  You'd better have your act together - mistakes are scrutinized and magnified. You can't "own your brand" anymore just by throwing a big pile of money into advertising and public relations. 10 years ago mgmt would have had a much easier time sweeping this under the rug.  

Thanks for the post and the rundown MPS.

I skied two days at Sunshine in late March 2007 and would go back in a second. Here's a taste of what it's like: Day 1 & Day 2.

I had lunch with a couple of the patrollers and I remember them going on about the mellow, relaxed atmosphere there. Needless to say, they didn't tell the guy from the east about the years of friction between management and employees.

Harvey44 wrote

One thing is sure, social networks have changed the PR game.  You'd better have your act together - mistakes are scrutinized and magnified.

One of these days, our state-owned ski mountains will understand this point.

From First Tracks!! Online News:

Kyle William Veith, 25, of Banff, and Colin Mathew Mansell, 25, of London, Ontario, crossed a closure rope into Sunshine's Wild West area on Monday and started the slide. Neither was buried. Wild West has been closed all season due to high avalanche risk.

The trespassing fines were imposed by the RCMP. The ski area is considering further action against the duo, as one was using someone else's season pass.

Full FTO news piece here.

In April:

TGR wrote

SUNSHINE POSTS

Hey folks,

We got a Cease and Desist from the Sunshine people demanding we remove the threads or we will be sued for monetary damages and they will come after us for the true identity of the posters. We have pulled the 2 threads for now and sent the cease and desist to our attorneys. I am a firm believer in people speaking their minds and the type of transparency the world has these days. We will put them back up if our attorney says we are ok to. That being said TGR is not in a position to get in a legal battle with people who have tons of money at this point. Ironically enough, I was one who was saying we should here both sides in one of the threads before we jump to conclusions. The threads are preserved though and can be reinstated. Thanks for your understanding on this. I think Mark Zuckerberg could probably afford the legal battle though if that makes sense. I will keep you posted as I learn more.

It's mind blowing that you could get legal advice this bad. Now SV owners are going after EpicSki.

And as someone mentioned on Epic — who has also been threaten with legal action and been forced to remove at least one thread — it would have been so much cheaper to do the right thing in the first place.

Post whatever you'd like in this thread. Also it's seems like the consensus in all the forums is to give the Facebook Fan Page for the Sunshine Ski Patrol the old "Like" on their page:

http://www.facebook.com/SupportSkiPatrol

Unbelievable.

(8300 fans at the time of this post - should be interesting to see what the response is).

I've been to Sunshine and there is very few ski areas that need a strong and experienced patrol more than this one.  The terrian is very avy prone and ranges from really steep to Holy Sh!t i think i need to change my underwear steep.  If its not sunny the ski area gets really small too because so much is above treeline that you can't see a damm thing if its snowing or windy and they close big sections of the mountain.  You have to respect the patrol on closures and based what i read on the patrol web page they ownership screwed up big time here.

We stayed at the mid mountian lodging - there is no lodging at the bottom - only part way up.  I preferred lake louise to Sunshine.  

LL was on the same ticket i think but i hope they have a different owner so that the staff let go can go over there and work.

ausable skier wrote

LL was on the same ticket i think but i hope they have a different owner so that the staff let go can go over there and work.

Yup, different ownership. Lake Loo is owned by Charlie Locke. He's partnered with Murray Edwards, the Alberta oil magnate who owns Resorts of the Canadian Rockies to form a separate company to own and operate Louise. Prior to that change in ownership in 2008 Louise was part of the RCR stable that includes Fernie, Kimberley, Nakiska, Mont-Sainte-Anne and Stoneham.

Did that Facebook page get taken down, too? jeez, talk about unleashing an army of lawyers. That kid is going to grow up to be a bigger shit than dad.

Here is an interesting interview with SSV's marketing guy, Doug Firby:
http://www.slopefillers.com/sunshine-village-social-media-doug-firby-interview/

It is interesting to note that Slopefillers is editing the comments, presumably to get rid of negativity. On the only remaining SSV thread on TGR, there is some amusing speculation that Gregg of Slopefillers and Greg of AlpineZone are the same person. I kind of doubt it but the earnestness is similar.

Sick Bird Rider wrote

It is interesting to note that Slopefillers is editing the comments, presumably to get rid of negativity.

Or to get rid of the truth....

 

Sick Bird Rider wrote

 there is some amusing speculation that Gregg of Slopefillers and Greg of AlpineZone are the same person. I kind of doubt it but the earnestness is similar.

Oooooooo.....a mystery !!! Hmmmm

Sick Bird Rider wrote

Here is an interesting interview with SSV's marketing guy, Doug Firby:
http://www.slopefillers.com/sunshine-village-social-media-doug-firby-interview/

Funny how they dance around the elephant in the room.

Jamesdeluxe wrote

Funny how they dance around the elephant in the room.

And avoid stepping in the big piles of elephant dung...

Man that is some heavy handed blog comment moderation. If we deleted every blog comment that strayed from the "topic" of the entry, we'd have half as many comments. More important, you end up with a disenchanted (and probably small) audience. Gregg clearly doesn't get the first rule of social media - you can't control the conversation.

I posted a comment purely on the topic of social media, with no specifics about the SSV situation - it will be interesting to see if it is moderated out or posted.

Harv, your comment was posted and replied to within five minutes. Now that you have tickled the elephant by posting a link to this thread, it will be interesting to see if HR receives a Cease & Desist order.

Unleash the Trolls !  

Sick Bird Rider wrote

Harv, your comment was posted and replied to within five minutes. Now that you have tickled the elephant by posting a link to this thread, it will be interesting to see if HR receives a Cease & Desist order.

I could only dream...

Good article in Powder Magazine:

http://www.powdermag.com/stories/making-locals-jaded/

Yea Powdermag! Keep the truth out there.

Oh, and, yea Harvey!

Benny Profane wrote

Yea Powdermag! Keep the truth out there.

Oh, and, yea Harvey!

Uh.... thanks Benny!  

Excerpts from Letter to Powder from Doug Firby the communications guy at Sunshine Village:


July 27, 2011
Powder Online

Dear Editor:

Re: Making locals jaded, July 11, 2011

...

The decision to let four senior employees go on Dec. 29, 2010, was not taken lightly, emotionally, harshly, quickly or without considerable review of the valid reasons for the action. It was a difficult one, but had to be done to ensure the safe and proper operation of the resort, including the enforcement of a ban on alcohol in the workplace. It is something we hope will never have to be done again.

The difficult dismissals in December were a necessary step in achieving the level of excellence we aspire to. Fortunately, we were able to hire outstanding replacements—people who truly have the guest experience at the forefront of their actions.

That is not the impression that has been created on the Internet. On Jan. 17, 2011, a few weeks after the dismissals, some members of the ski patrol staged a one-day illegal walkout, in which they called in sick. It was an attempt, according to one of the protestors, “to bring the resort to its knees.”

Since then, Sunshine has endured a constant, unjustified, and absolutely unfair Internet and social media battering, many from sympathizers for the ex-employees. The vicious attacks have been personal in nature, flung out to create emotional scars, not to reflect what really took place. Rumors are stated as fact, the truth is abused, and the effects are painful not only to ownership and Sunshine’s managers, but to all our employees, as well. For example, call center employees, who had nothing to do with the dismissals, have had to endure prolonged verbal abuse on our toll free 1-87-SKI-BANFF line.

There are many similar examples, as emotion let the story spin out of control. Comments, blogs, and Internet stories came from thousands of miles away, written by people jumping on false rumors and not aware of the truth. Meanwhile, Sunshine was legally unable to tell its side of the story until its statement of defense was filed in Alberta court.

Although there has been a great deal of misinformation, at Sunshine Village, our guidelines for responses are to stick to the facts, be respectful in replies and try not to get drawn into debates. We have done our best to turn the other cheek, but sometimes when the facts are so distorted, the misinformation so intolerant and personal, we ask for retractions or the removal of the offending falsehoods. Others, both people and companies, facing the same humbling experience would probably do the same.

Deciding how to react is often a very tough judgement. We do so with a focus on integrity and ethical behaviour—not with a goal to deny legitimate free speech.

By seeking a cease-and-desist order on the TGR material, we were accused of censorship. But anyone knows that the freedom of speech has never included the right to incite hatred. Libel and slander laws continue to exist in the Internet age. Those who spread hatred on the Internet behind an anonymous identity are no more defenders of free speech than vigilantes are defenders of civil rights.

Doug Firby
Associate Director, Communications
Sunshine Village Ski & Snowboard Resort

Thanks for posting this, Harv. It is worth clicking the link, reading the full letter and the string of comments below. Firby has clearly made his bed, is lying in it and refusing to wake up and smell the coffee. The guy does his job well though, you have to give him credit for the vast number of keywords he sprinkled into his letter. I think Harv told me once that is called "keyword loading."

This comment on the Powdermag page pretty much sums it up for me:

Mr. Firby, that was transparent, pathetic, and if you had any credibility or respect to begin with that would have diminished it significantly.

Moreover, why are you doing this during the OFFSEASON?! This would be the perfect opportunity to let this die while people are thinking about things besides skiing. You’re in a deep freakin’ hole. Stop digging.