Is telemarkering hard? Warm-Up Day at MLSM, 12/7/13

If you are a freeheel skier, you will no doubt be familiar with ridiculous questions like, "are you a telemarketer?" or, "are those cross-country skis?" and my personal fave, "do your skis have edges?" Yesterday, an eight year old asked the question posed in the thread title, which, at first glance, might seem like another one in the long list of "stupid telemark questions." Actually, it was a perfectly good question simply skewed by kid language. So, without correcting him, I gave a polite but smart-ass grownup response in my best conspiratorial tone: "Not really - it just looks hard. That's why we do it, it is the perfect sport for old guys."  The tele instructor sandwiching him on the other side of the six-pack chair added: "and it is twice as fun as it looks!" The kid seemed to get it. I predict that he will be asking Mom and Dad for telemarkering skis this Christmas...

Look at all those telemarkering skis!


That's what you get when a bunch of freeheelers gather at a Hinterlandian bump in early December - a telemark conspiracy. With 65 of us to spread the stoke of tele throughout the day, the freeheelers definitely made an impression. Enough of one, at least, to get the 80 year-old resort owner to come out and yodel for us at the end of the day.

Everyone in this picture is on tele gear (B. Backland photo). That's me in the red jacket. TD is sporting green. Note the lake-effect snow falling at a great rate.  


Developing this level of tele stoke didn't just happen in one day. On Saturday, TD and I made the trek south to Mount St. Louis - Moonstone to attend the 30th anniversary "Ski Telemark Warm-Up Day" put on by our friends Holly and Steve, who, for 30 seasons, have operated a mobile tele ski school called Ski Telemark. They are kind of like the Hinterlandian version of Dickie Hall and NATO.

Although I don't think Dickie Hall wears a Santa hat and gives out farm-fresh apples at the registration table.


Telemark Dave and I were a bit skeptical of taking a lesson. You know, can't teach an old dog new tricks, and that sort of thing. So we signed up for the session with Quebecois guest instructor Stephane Perrault, which Holly assured me would be "less talking and more skiing." Stephane is as good as they come, a Level 3 "telemark course conductor" in the Hinterlandian system. This means he is certified at the top level of teaching people to be telemark instructors. The guy was very good, both at skiing and teaching. Best of all, he was French, so that added a certain flair to the day. I learned a lot. And I can hardly walk on the day after.

Stephane explains why we should weight the outside ski.


Before the sessions started, we got four fantastic runs in, enjoying unexpected boot-top powder off Lake Huron. It snowed like crazy until late morning, then the band drifted north and the sun came out. WOO HOO - bluebird powder day at the 550 vertical foot oasis of snow sliding. It was just us and the alpine instructor courses, snowboard instructor courses, park rat courses, plus the general skiing/snowboarding/snowlerblading public. It all seemed to work out.

This is the whole vertical hill, though it does spread out more along the ridge. The runs are pretty long, and they have built these giant earth-mounds on top to add more vert:


We skied hard all day, with Stephane simply giving us various exercises and quick tips to improve our technique. For you telemarkers out there, the emphasis was on weighting the outside ski, hand position and standing tall in the transition through the fall line. Makes all the difference, and by the end of the day I felt as though I had learned to tele all over again. That, and my quads were going into spasm.

The sun was shining and things were getting a bit tracked out by lunch time. Tempting as it looks, there nothing but pain and injury under that snow to looker's right:


So, the bottom line is: never think that you are too old or too good to take a lesson. You can teach old dogs new tricks, or at least remind them of those tricks they have forgotten about because they spend so much time in the woods.

My 7 year old daughter and I were at MSLM on Saturday and saw you guys. She said to me, " Wow Dad, those guys look more cool than the boarders in the park." She was fascinated watching them on Sundance.

gasman wrote

My 7 year old daughter and I were at MSLM on Saturday and saw you guys. She said to me, " Wow Dad, those guys look more cool than the boarders in the park." She was fascinated watching them on Sundance.

Thanks gasman, small world that you were there too. It is a pretty rare and beautiful sight to see that many freeheelers in one place, at least in our neck of the woods. If you ever get the urge to try it, check out Ski Telemark's schedule, their instructors are top-notch. They even offer evening lessons right in T.O., at Earl Bales Park. Many people have no idea there is lift-served skiing in Toronto, accessible by public transit!

By the way, if you are bored of the hills north of the city, and don't mind a little extra driving, check out Sir Sams in Haliburton. Not a lot of vertical but really fun terrain and a fantastic atmosphere. Pretty mellow and family-oriented. Even though I live a 15 minute drive from Hidden Valley, I'll drive the hour to Sir Sams if conditions are good.

Oh, wait, are we supposed to talking about skiing in New York? Sorry.

Telemarking is dying with its demographic.  I don't know a single person under 45 that skis freeheel.  Not one.  And it's definitely a license to suck.  Most every telemarker you see on the hill sucks.  There are some exceptions, of course, but most are just a bunch of douchey, old boomers using a binding and a turn to disguise a complete lack of skills and athletic ability.  It's over.  It had its renaissance in the 80s and 90s but now its done.  There's no younger generation taking up the torch.  AT bindings/boots are better and lighter now than anything tele has to offer so why would anyone choose to ski an inferior binding that weighs more than a real one?

And I don't want you arguing with me about it SBR.  Just admit that you and your lifestyle completely suck and apologize for posting a TR about a bunch of old jackasses flailing around on some molehill making a fool of themselves.

I don’t care what you think of NJ’s persona on this forum…you gotta admit that was funny.

First of all, I thought there were 4 levels in the Canada ski instructing system. Also, I don't usually teach a weighted outside foot, because usually people coming from Alpine weigh that foot too much. This results in the dreaded T bone position with a downhill ski cruising on its edge, but the uphill ski perpendicular to that ski, pointing downhill and crossing everything up.

As for Noah's dumb opinion, I'm 33, and I've been telemarking for 15 years. I've run into (and taught) a lot of people younger than me, people that are psyched about Tele turns. Maybe you don't see a big Tele contingent at a racer's mountain like Whiteface, but there's a DEEP Tele crew at Gore, young and old. Also, I find Tele to be better in the ADK backcountry because a lot of the approaches are long slogs that are better to kick and glide with Tele equipment, instead of flopping around on AT gear. Don't know why you picked this thread to be a dick on, NJ, but in your attempt to score argument points on SBR, you just made yourself look like an idiot.

EDIT: Ahhh, joking again... Got it

Noah, that discussion has been done to death in many other places and I have no intention of arguing with you about it, other than to tell you that you are wrong. But as we all know, that is a pointless exercise.

Edit: oh, wait, you were joking?

mattchuck2 wrote

First of all, I thought there were 4 levels in the Canada ski instructing system. Also, I don't usually teach a weighted outside foot, because usually people coming from Alpine weigh that foot too much. This results in the dreaded T bone position with a downhill ski cruising on its edge, but the uphill ski perpendicular to that ski, pointing downhill and crossing everything up.

Matt, I don't know how the Canadian Alpine people organize things but tele is stuck with the Nordic instructor program, CANSI. The session we were in was for advanced skiers, and Stephane comes at things from a tele racing perspective. He did point out that in many conditions it is appropriate to shift the weight around between the lead and rear ski. What we were practicing was very hardpack-focussed, despite the pow day. It seemed to work, by the end of the day everyone in the group was sucking a lot less.

Sick Bird Rider wrote

What we were practicing was very hardpack-focussed, despite the pow day.

See, that's another weird thing. It's hard for me to steer my uphill (trailing) ski unless I have a little weight on it, especially in pow (the uphill ski gets knocked around and goes off in weird directions when I focus my weight on the downhill ski). That's why I usually like to teach two footed skiing in alpine and Tele.

But, apparently, according to training this past weekend, the alpine world is also going with a downhill ski focus this year, so what do I know?

Highpeaksdrifter wrote

I don’t care what you think of NJ’s persona on this forum…you gotta admit that was funny.

YES it was ---- doesn't he Tele??? That makes it even funnier.

I think that a few years ago the age thing was true. Telemarkers were mostly older guys.  But in the last two or three years I'm starting to see more young kids skiing freeheel at Gore and Plattekill. I wish I could find a picture I posted last year of two girls on Sunway at Gore on teles - they were maybe 8 and 10.

Are far as the quality of telemarkers goes... hard to say. I do think when you don't have proper technique on tele it is obvious.  But with the thousands of skiers on the mountain and clearly more fixed heel, you've got plenty of beginners on all kinds of gear.

I fall into the stereo type - older skier, not really very good. Probably never will be a true expert.  So what? I'm having fun.  On the other hand the very best skiers at Gore seem to telemark at least some of the time.  MC, Zach and who is that new guy who rips?

campgottagopee wrote

Highpeaksdrifter wrote

I don’t care what you think of NJ’s persona on this forum…you gotta admit that was funny.

YES it was ---- doesn't he Tele??? That makes it even funnier.

Yuuuuuuuup.   Made me smile.   Thanks NJ.   Just what a Monday back at the office needed.
 
Oh, and SBR didn't use the right meds, I offered lots of NSAID's, but he would only take 1 Vitamin I.
My legs are fine today.   Obviously I didn't try hard enough at sucking.    Next time.  Promise.  

TD

mattchuck2 wrote

But, apparently, according to training this past weekend, the alpine world is also going with a downhill ski focus this year, so what do I know?

This was mentioned, obviously the same thought process up here and the tele world is following along.

FWIW, I believe that there are two levels of tele instructor certs in Canada. Level 3 is "course conductor," which means you can teach instructor courses and certify level ones and twos. There is a level 4 in nordic instruction and I have no idea about the alpine world.

CONTENTS DELETED

Sick Bird Rider wrote

mattchuck2 wrote

But, apparently, according to training this past weekend, the alpine world is also going with a downhill ski focus this year, so what do I know?

This was mentioned, obviously the same thought process up here and the tele world is following along.

Actually, standing upright 99% on the downhill ski was always part of the tele racing world, even back in the late 80's and early 90's.   It's taken CANSI this long to catch up.   Go figure.  What I used to do, I changed when I migrated to the off-piste world and relearned to suit.   In all reality it's always been that way.  The tele turn is dynamic.  That's the beauty of it.   Or ugliness of it.  

TD

DackerDan wrote

If NJ's assessment is correct, tele skiers can be seen riding their recumbents during the off season, long grey beards flowing in the breeze.

SUP. Don't forget SUP and slack lining.

Enjoyed the Hinterland report SBR.  I know it's flat as a pancake up by you, but mounding up dirt at the top of the hill for a few extra feet of vert seems pretty extreme (and expensive).  That snow sure looks nice though.

I've really been thinking about taking a series of lessons or getting some coaching myself.  For one thing, I've never had any  formal ski instruction.  I realize that I know very little about skiing from a technical perspective.  Why not try to improve my skill level?

As for NJ's comment about telemark's dying demographic, I don't think so at all.  We've got several ski friends with kids that tele, like Zack, age 11:

Another family that we ski with has 2 girls in maybe 5th and 7th grades, the girls have been tele'ing for years. Then there's my buddy Greg, age 26, who gave up snowboarding last year for tele.  I realize that's all just anecdotal, but it backs up what Matt said about there being a pretty deep base of telemarkers at Gore.

Excellent self awareness Noah John! Admitting you have a problem is the first step!

^^^  

NJ takes his first step towards enlightenment!!