Let's Brainstorm Gore Summer Money Making Ideas

Ok. Well it must be said that it was very nice of ADKSkier to start this thread. He seems to have a mild skepticism of Gore's/NC's  "affirmative action " and yet he tries to help his community. Thanks ADKSkier.

Another such individual seems to be Jeff Palka of the Gear Source. I've read about him here, talked to him once on the phone and he seems like no soggy bread type person. Rather he appears to possess a " Just Do It " personality. I respect that and find it's one thing that makes a huge difference in any endeavor....the 212th degree if you will.

Anyway, why not try and help Jeff Palka? It seems a big obstacle to Gore region new biking venues is getting the word out to those who would use any bike trails and become customers. Customers Goooood!!!!

I think we can help him. He certainly seems worthy of our assistance. Anybody else interested? Here's something we can do if you're willing and Jeff Palka is on board too >

I'll contact DH Mike and ask him what forums, etc he used to spread the word about Face DH. Remember when he joined SkiADK, he said he posted on many forums regularly. We could do that for Jeff Palka too. I've talked to DH Mike before and he always offers to do whatever he can to help out with bike stuff in this area, so I think he'll be glad to help and is indeed a well spring of info/resources. DH Mike will likely have other ideas for us. Think it over....and let's do it.

I'll contact Palka and DH Mike and get back to you guys.

Harvey44 wrote

Harvey Road will offer a free Gear Source bike tune ($30 value) to the first Forum member who posts a Garnet Hill TR in our Summer Sports Forum. Get out there!

One easy way to help JMP/TGS...  go to Garnet Hill, ride the trails and post a sweet Trip Report. We'll try to help it get seen.

EDIT: wasn't dissing snowball's idea, just throwing in my two cents.

OH, you don't like my other idea? Ok.

Snowballs wrote

The Warrior run drew something like 1,700 competitors, some @ $50 a pop, That's pretty good cha-ching. People I spoke to had a blast! Which reminds me,,,where's ADKJEFF?!?! Is he still stuck out on the Warrior trail? Did the ghost of Magua lift his scalp? Did he catch on fire leaping through one of the fire hoops? Is he now signing soprano after straddling a log? Stuck in the mud? WHAT !?!? APB on ADK.

Right here dude!
Yup, the Warrior Run was great, a really fun time.  Thousands of participants and spectators stayed, ate, drank and partied after the race was done.  I put a report from the Warrior Run on my blog, linked here, or click on the link in my signature at the bottom of this message.  And you're right SB, Mike Barbone has put significant effort into developing West Mountain's off-season (summer) ops - the Warrior Run is just one recent example.

mattchuck2 wrote

 I guess the question is, should it be Gore Mountain's responsibility to prop up the town?

Part of ORDA's mission is to use its facilities as an economic engine for the region. They've done a good job for North Creek in the winter, but there's close to zero effort the rest of the year.  The Adirondack Almanack piece noted that the success in Wilmintgon was the result of coordinated efforts between ORDA, WF mgt, DEC, biking enthusiasts, the town and local business people. I think it's fair to expect that for North Creek to be successful there will need to be similar cooperation among ORDA, Gore mgt and the town.  That said, I have gotten many, many ORDA press releases this spring and summer about all of the summer events going on in WF and LP, but zero from ORDA about anything at all in North Creek.  Given ORDA's mission to serve as an economic engine, I would think that ORDA would charge Gore Mgt with the task of working with the North Creek community to develop summer activities and events (zip line, mt biking, Warrior Run, whatever) that would use the Gore facilities to leverage economic activity in the town.

If North Creek is in trouble, I don't know (and it's not really clear in the Adk Almanack piece either) if it's ORDA, Gore mgt or the town who dropped the ball (probably a combination), but I think the ultimate responsibility comes back to ORDA.

He Lives!!! hehe. read your report, fun stuff!! Next year, we'll be able to watch from the ziiiiipppplinnee.

You also brought some sound logic to this debate, where da heck is ORDA's effort to stimulate NC's summer economy? Is it in the same bin as Auntie Em's marketing?

A very good example of why Belle deserves/needs representation on ORDA's board. And where is NC's representation on ORDA's board? Is there any? Are they a bunch of spineless yes men?

Sure is lots going on in Placid and many projects being are developed there THROUGH  co-operation, as Jeff noted. I agree ORDA should do much more and like you said the Town, et al must help too.

All that's needed is a can do spirit.

Snowballs wrote

Another such individual seems to be Jeff Palka of the Gear Source. I've read about him here, talked to him once on the phone and he seems like no soggy bread type person. Rather he appears to possess a " Just Do It " personality. I respect that and find it's one thing that makes a huge difference in any endeavor....the 212th degree if you will.

Anyway, why not try and help Jeff Palka? It seems a big obstacle to Gore region new biking venues is getting the word out to those who would use any bike trails and become customers. Customers Goooood!!!!

I think we can help him. He certainly seems worthy of our assistance. Anybody else interested? Here's something we can do if you're willing and Jeff Palka is on board too >

I'll contact DH Mike and ask him what forums, etc he used to spread the word about Face DH. Remember when he joined SkiADK, he said he posted on many forums regularly. We could do that for Jeff Palka too. I've talked to DH Mike before and he always offers to do whatever he can to help out with bike stuff in this area, so I think he'll be glad to help and is indeed a well spring of info/resources. DH Mike will likely have other ideas for us. Think it over....and let's do it.

I'll contact Palka and DH Mike and get back to you guys.

IMO that’s a good idea. Here’s an article from 2 years ago on how the Mt. Bike trails in Wilmington came to be.
http://newyorkoutdoors.wordpress.com/2009/06/06/new-bike-trail-system-opens-in-wilmington/
When government (local and state) cooperate with volunteer organizations good things can happen.

Snowballs wrote

I'll contact DH Mike and ask him what forums, etc he used to spread the word about Face DH.

DH Mike was very active in the MTB forums at least as far back as 2006.

forums.mtbr.com
www.vitalmtb.com
nycmtb.com

Be interested to hear what he has to say about which forums are the strongest in the East.  I'd also like to hear from DHM, about what kind of terrain has the best chance to succeed financially.

Not sure but Matt may know something about the MTB forums too.

NCPR had a blog entry this am on the whole ORDA/North Creek thing:

http://blogs.northcountrypublicradio.org/inbox/2011/06/29/is-orda-short-changing-north-creek/

Didn't add a whole lot to the discussion (re)started by the Post-Star or Adirondack Almanack, but good to see the story getting a little more play.

Thanks HPD!

Well, no response from Jeff Palka.....no harm no foul......carry on.

Suggested it before and I'll suggest it again. Want to drive some traffic from Gore to North Creek? Start advertising INSIDE the gondolas--for a fee let the downtown business put a menu or store ad in a plexiglass case inside the gondola. Nothing like a captive audience for ~10 minutes. How many times have you read the trivia thing inside those cars? Plenty...

Doesn't solve the summer problem, but it'll drive some traffic in the winter and the mountain will make a few extra bucks.

SIAWOL wrote

Suggested it before and I'll suggest it again. Want to drive some traffic from Gore to North Creek? Start advertising INSIDE the gondolas--for a fee let the downtown business put a menu or store ad in a plexiglass case inside the gondola. Nothing like a captive audience for ~10 minutes. How many times have you read the trivia thing inside those cars? Plenty...

Doesn't solve the summer problem, but it'll drive some traffic in the winter and the mountain will make a few extra bucks.

Simple too.

I like the Source's idea - the Weekly Garnet Hill MTB race:

http://www.facebook.com/pages/the-SOURCE/55471074146#!/event.php?eid=200523449995612

$5 entry, and a prize for first.  I'd like to sponsor a rider!

SIAWOL wrote

Suggested it before and I'll suggest it again. Want to drive some traffic from Gore to North Creek? Start advertising INSIDE the gondolas--for a fee let the downtown business put a menu or store ad in a plexiglass case inside the gondola. Nothing like a captive audience for ~10 minutes. How many times have you read the trivia thing inside those cars? Plenty...

Doesn't solve the summer problem, but it'll drive some traffic in the winter and the mountain will make a few extra bucks.

As someone else said, high peaks hiking is better and there is no lake. Even if the mountain did something like a zip line or waterslide I'm not sure it would draw anything more than day trippers from other vacation spots. I've wondered about offering camping, but not sure if there would be many takers.

I think one thing that could draw people would be different events through the summer. A soccer tournament (need the fields), a cycling event, a baseball tournament, jazz festival, astronomy weekend, etc. I know the youth sporting events have nothing to do with the mountain, but they can draw a significant crowd.  

Or maybe ORDA can build a dam to create a nice lake!!!

Tom

Or maybe a golf course. Many of the Vermont mountains have attached golf courses that keep the place going in the off-season.  My husband and I went to a golf camp at Mt. Snow one year and had a blast.  The accommodations were horrible but it was so nice to be outside in the mountains that we loved it. We also did a golf package in Lake Placid via the Holiday Inn (now the Crown Plaza) and it was great.  I'm guessing that golf courses would be a much bigger investment than ORDA or any private developer would be wiling to do though.

Golf is in the Ski Bowl Village plan...when they get to it.

Oddly, in '03 or so Golf magazine rated Glen's Falls as the best golf location in the nation.....

I read this article today about Steamboat Springs:

Steamboat is primed to be a vibrant bike destination. Two boutique bike makers, Moots and Eriksen, are crafting high-end rides in town. Honey Stinger, the nation's largest maker of honey-based energy food and co-owned by Lance Armstrong, is based in Steamboat. Point6 socks and SmartWool apparel are headquartered in Steamboat and are popular with cyclists.

The conversion is well underway. In the next month, Steamboat ski area will finish a top-to-bottom mountain bike course, much like Winter Park's booming Trestle Bike Park, which has grown from 7,000 visits a year in 2006 to 50,000 this summer with 524 daily bike rentals. Whistler, British Columbia, is the international model for summer bike business with a 12-year-old park that has 130,000 visits a year. The plan, which went through federal environmental review, would add miles of beginner to expert lift-served bike trails to the Steamboat ski area.

"If you guys aren't bigger than Winter Park in five years, I'd be surprised," said John Cowan, a former downhill racer who designs and develops park features for Gravity Logic, which is building the Steamboat park.

I'm not saying that Gore should go crazy on mountain biking.  I'm just saying it should pick one thing and be better at it than any other mountain in the east.  If it wants to have a Zipline/Mountain Ropes course, it should blow Hunter Mountain out of the water.  If it wants to have mountain biking, it should be 1,000 times better than Whiteface/Wilmington, and on par with the Kingdom trails.  If it wants to focus on hiking, golf, or waterpark, they have to make it better than anywhere else, otherwise it's just a diversion and not a destination.

"The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated" - North Creek, NY (ok Twain, but who's checking)

We have had our place in NC now for six years and have seen many businesses come (laura's, black mountain, new trappers, barking spider, poiema home, bar vino, pete's ah, ski bowl cafe, basil and wicks, new alpine motel, north creek rafting company, SNCRR, etc. etc.) AND and go (caseys, mountain boarder town, old trappers (loved their wings and blue cheese), snow train, smiths (before andies), wallie's steak house, emmy's videos, common roots, laura's, the old alpine motel, north creek deli etc. etc.  Throughout all of that turnover there has been little that gore has done in the off season other than the fall harvest festival.  Is there lots that they could do to partner with the chamber of commerce and at least help advertise events already in flight?  You bet.  Do business owners have a gripe? You bet.  Do they sit around wallowing in pity as some people seem to think?  No way.  

The business owners and locals have done so many things to drive business to town in the offseason that many of you might not realize.  Here is just a smattering:

Whitewater Derby
Blue grass festival at the ski bowl
Waynestock at ski bowl
Circus at ski bowl
4 or 5 concerts on the hudson in the summer
farmers market
car cruise
art walk
spring beer festival
fall ales to rails
Ididaride bike tour in august (starts and ends in north creek)
Music and art events at tannery pond
thomas the train weekend
race the train (back next year)

Is it the mountain's place to market these events to folks?  Should they be sending weekly email blasts out to their winter email distribution list with all the things going on in town?  You decide.  When we bought our place we had maybe 3 or 4 rentals in the offseason.  This year we were rented 75% or more of weekends from mid may through the end of august.  I was in town for the beer festival which was busy, we spent a week in july at our house and were amazed at how busy town was.  We had to wait 40 minutes for a table at bar vino on a Thursday night.  We were just up for the weekend of ales to rails and people were overflowing out of the bars at 10pm on saturday night.  I have never seen so many people in town.  There was an exciting vibe in the air.  In many ways the businesses in town have taken things into their own hands.

There are tons of things to do in the area in the summer.  Most of our off season renters use north creek as a home base to explore the southern ADKs.  There may not be high peaks but there are great hikes within 30 minutes. Some people don't want to hike a 3 or 4k peak anyway.  Loon lake is 15 minutes away, minerva beach is 10 minutes away, newcomb is 45 minutes. Indian lake, blue mountain lake, long lake are all drivable.  If you don't want to pay waterfront rent then it is a great choice.  You can get to lake george or bolton in 45 minutes if you want.  There are many more things that could be done and Gore could help, but I for one think the area has made great strides in becoming more of a year round destination.  I was a skeptic of the railroad, but it has brought even more visitors to the area.  

I think some adventure races would be great for the area.  I did the "official" warrior dash at windham this year and they had waves of people running the race for two days from 9AM-5PM.  Over 9000 people ran it on Saturday and over 8500 on Sunday.  Think that would bring some people in to town?  Alpine uphill races, tough mudder, spartan race, etc. People love doing adventure races.  More beer/music festivals.  Some creative thinking without having to spend a ton of money is what is needed.  Bring in events that other people run, produce and advertise.  Wouldn't make much money for the mountain, but it wouldn't require much from them either.  I don't think that anything that is capital intensive like a "real" mountain bike park or a zipline or a mountain coaster is going to ever happen.  Half hearted attempts only waste money and don't bring in many visitors.

I guess my point is that there are lots of things going on in north creek.  Many of the businesses that have closed this year have reasons other than the economy like the landlord jacked the rent up,  the owner is in the middle of a divorce, the owner would end up in divorce because the business took so much time, etc.  Gore could do much more, but the businesses in town aren't waiting around for something to happen.  What I think is really cool too is that they all seem to help each other out a little.  They know that a rising tide floats all boats.

I will continue to think on this idea....


Quickies:


1) Easier mtn bike paths for families--coming up from LG.    WF is good but on the Expert side.    As noted, every venue needs it niche' market.        I came up this weekend hoping to MTN bike Gore, then WF.    Weather stopped us and we hit other trails.   But (my bad for sure) I was unaware that I would not be able to bike Gore.   How many others?

2) SKATE BOARD PARK....initial expense but then little maintence.     Big pool type park...then ramps etc.   Draw riders from LG on vacation and then tornies...several times in the summer.  

3) Live music every weekend:   There are lots of bands...become the spot.  The frist couple of years one might have to have free or cheep bands, but then band will start asking to come--and pay Gore for the venue and they sell out via ticket master.    

4) Wilderness Camp weekends...for families or whatever.     Someone mentioned camping.   Tons of trees fall and get cut...huge bonfires with a guitar player on Saturday nights....20.00 tent fees, have beer, smores, soda, food...etc.  Simple lean-tos can be built and then rented for those families that dont like to sleep on the ground.    Breakfast and lunch and maybe a hotel room would get NC business district involved.    Rafting co's might get more business, or Gore would get some sleep overs from rafting current daytrippers.    

5) Free--yes free--nature walks, down the mountain...turn the gondi on for an hour to get folks up.    FREE...yep free.    Once people start coming, they stay, spend money, come back...maybe skiing?  Maybe tenting, maybe for the concerts, that would grow in volume and quality.  

6) build  a few leantos or Yurts...start multi day guided tours around the mountain wilderness areas..for familiies, guys or couples...yes "market" them.     Girls weekends are huge now...Nice wine dinners out in a yurt...get them walking and paying 100s of dollars for a nice dinner and some wine in the woods.  

7) Actually hire someone for the summer income and pay them based on performance....GOD FORBID.   Then hope they make $200,000 in bonuses a year...meaning Gore made $10,000, 000.    

Why is there no summer activity....?   Why does a photo last on the Gore Website for 2 weeks when it is effectively free to publish and update it..in about 3 minutes?    State/Union workers with no incentive to suceed beyond keeping their job for another year.       I Just noticed the union sign at the corner of PV and R28, NICE.  ..maybe I am misinformed on this and will apologize for ranting in advance.