NCAA

Anyone who follows college athletics has long known the corruptness of the NCAA. It's going to be interesting to see where this stops, or if it even does.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2017/9/27/16367814/ncaa-basketball-fbi-investigation-coaches-agents-adidas 

campgottagopee wrote

Anyone who follows college athletics has long known the corruptness of the NCAA. It's going to be interesting to see where this stops, or if it even does.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2017/9/27/16367814/ncaa-basketball-fbi-investigation-coaches-agents-adidas

No surprise here. Any system that seems ok with 1 and done is bent from the word go. By the way, Pitino was fired.

Agree. I was only surprised because it took them so long.

And the AD was fired. I'm cool with it. Pitino seemed to always have our number here at Cuse.

No surprise with Pitino , glad he and AD were found complicit ., but complicity does not end there . It is part of the intitutional hierarchy

Frankly at D 1 this stuff has been going on for years to one degree or another. Look D One is a BUSINESS plain and simple always has been. In spiite of all the PIOUS PIFFLE , at the end of the day ,asses on seats pays the freight for many institutional activities at THAT LEVEL .

Admittedly i am an ole fart purist who coached collegiate level hoops as a young man . It was JUCO Or now known as NJCAA . There were no such arrangements , kids played because they could . Sure there was legit financial aid within the Federal regs that apply to all students, but students  actually graduated and transferred or went to real jobs  upon degree completion  . Winning was important but being competitive and expecting your kids to survive academically was a driving force too.
 
I am a supporter of D3 and D2 level expectations , ie student athletes not pro training camp recruits

DI is a pre professional minor league feeder system .....nothing more . Its all about winning , TV rights , alumni and booster contributions and all the other financial incentives that surround a for profit situation . It is right NO ! Not until the expectations are managed and the hypocrisy taken out of those expectations . THESE ARE NOT STUDENTS they are indentured servants at best or underpaid employees at worst  

But reality is such that until we recognize that , things will never change .

Oh dust ups will occur , people will get blacklisted and righteous indignation will occur .  So what is the answer ??

How can this environment best be improved ?? thoughts .. Reactions ??

 

I'm just pissed cause when I was recruited to play hoops in the NAIA  nobody offered my a hooker

I think you hit the nail right on the head Warp when you called D1 sports a biz. Maybe the answer is to pay these athletes and not hide behind the word "student" athlete?  They truly are pro training grounds so maybe it's time to embrace that instead of trying to cover it up. Please don't misunderstand me I think there is and always will be the true student athlete but at that level it takes an amazing person to pull that off. Because let me tell you swimming laps at 5AM totally sucked ass!

Yes it is a very difficult expectation Camper ! I watched my son a 3 sport Division one athlete while earning a degree in the Medical profession .. ITQ WAS HARD ! He passed up a great deal at UCONN as a freshman because at that time we both thought D one was a stretch on his time given the rigor involved with his program of study .

So he opted for a D2 school , but that University ultimately ratcheted up to D1 level in his fourth year and it was difficult to do one sport let alone 3 ..

In his fifth  year of a medical education he still had one season of eligibility left in ONE of his sports BUT by that time with Externships, regular rotations in various levels of different organizations , hospitals research facilities in addition to course work it BECAME impossible  .

I think we NEED a totally different model for Division One that is all i am saying .  it is not a realistic situation as it is currently structured . I think the PROS need to ANTE Up for the cost of it  too

warp daddy wrote

 

I think we NEED a totally different model for Division One that is all i am saying .  it is not a realistic situation as it is currently structured . I think the PROS need to ANTE Up for the cost of it  too

I agree! The thought of bringing the pros into it makes sense as well. After all they're the ones who will ultimately benefit. It's the least they can do being nonprofit and all.

Warp JR --- 3 sport D1 --- damn Big Daddy Warp that's some serious DNA you carry around

Camper thank you BUT , trust me. I sucked !!!

My  speech to the Athletic Banquet at the college usualy had THIS story in it :

Hell when i was a college athlete i was  a REAL STUD ,  there in RED n' Gold uniform  . Yep played THREE freakin positions END , GUARD and Tackle . Waiting for the usual response i d say " well thats the way i remeber it" but in reality I. Sat on the END o the bench , Guarded the water bucket  andTackled the first sumbitch that came near it .

Nah nuttin special like you WARHORSE ( you woulda been a damn aircraft carrier in the paint on one o my hoop squads )  
 

warp daddy wrote

 

Hell when i was a college athlete i was  a REAL STUD ,  there in RED n' Gold uniform  . Yep played THREE freakin positions END , GUARD and Tackle . Waiting for the usual response i d say " well thats the way i remeber it" but in reality I. Sat on the END o the bench , Guarded the water bucket  andTackled the first sumbitch that came near it .

 

Too funny!

So Campy yer ole college coach ever give ya this line about using the triangle for  blocking out :  " i don't  wanna see nuthin but asses n elbows , use em boyz "       Hahahha loved my players , still do . great bunch o men

He sure did! My HS coach is truly the one who taught me how to use my body to box out. You know, something they no longer do. Bwahahahahahahahah

My college coach taught me how to hold jersey's tho  

In all fairness tho, these guys now play a completely different game than what I played. We had set plays, we had to because we weren't the athletes these guys are today. LOL --  I shake my head in amazement when I watch today's basketball games.  

True all of that !!!


Had a good laff about holding jerseys , On D i  told my kids to hold opponents on the bottom of their shorts from behind . , refs can't see it .  Course the hoop shorts then were WELL SHORT not these long floppy suckers of  today .

Yep set plays , hit the open man  , move the damn ball in the air its quicker and in my day cross court passing was a MORTAL SIN  

and alley oop shit !!, damn near impossible when your aircraft carrier is a whopping 6''2"" hahahha  i am fn ancient  !!😳

Kids today are damn gazelles , have tremendous body control and strength and can handle the rock ...but ill be a sumbitch lazy beotches can7't shoot fouls for diddly . And blocking out fuggeeditaboutit !  Few teams play tenacious D.

Rules should be changed but students shouldn't get paid for college athletics.  If you take the value of a 4-year scholarship vs. financing that education, you're looking at - what - half a million dollars of value?  Whether or not you, as a student athlete, study or make use of the education, that's up to you.

What should change in the students' favor is being able to switch schools at the end of the school year, on-campus food and residence and full benefits-style medical care while you are under scholarship.

If you start paying kids (legitimately), it will get really awful.

I hear ya, but why should the schools make all the money? It's a slippery slope. If I thought what you are talking about would end all the backdoor deals and corruption we now know as the NCAA then I'd be all for it. But isn't that what we've already been doing?

Being these corporate guys are involved maybe they should put up money for the scholarships. Or make "donations" to the school (scholarships) with the intent that a certain percentage of the donations go to local HS sports programs supporting those who support the University's by buying tickets for games.

DB I too hear you and have struggled with the concept too as both a former college president and former college coach .

The situation merits a serious investigation by an " INDEPENDENT " commission representing all the principle stakeholders .  Things need to change or these issues will never resolve

I absolutely agree about a set aside for enriched medical coverage for athletes as a minimum .

On a more controversial side i also lean toward incentivising an education for all  D 1 athletes by having the pros subsidize the establishment of an endowment that guarantees  both insurance  and a  amount payable equal to perhaps a portion of the MINIMUM  starting salary for a PRO  player on a pro rata basis based on yrs of eligibilty. This then might be availble to an athlete at the completion of their eligibility ,WHATEVER the duration of that eligibility is .

Why because kids suffer career ending injuries often before completing 4 yrs and have need to have the ability to continue their education and make life altering decisions .

Yes i KNOW this is weird and could lead to problems and i am certainly open to other ideas ,  but again my concern here is for those kids who suffer career ending injuries .

I would also say that the NCAA compliance office would need to adjudicate each individual case should such a  plan be invoked .
 

campgottagopee wrote

I hear ya, but why should the schools make all the money?

I think you're thinking of football and basketball primarily.  There are a lot of other sports too that make no dough.

To answer your question, because (presumably) it goes back into improving the higher education, campus facilities, scholarship/financing opportunities, etc.

D.B. Cooper wrote

campgottagopee wrote

I hear ya, but why should the schools make all the money?

I think you're thinking of football and basketball primarily.  There are a lot of other sports too that make no dough.

To answer your question, because (presumably) it goes back into improving the higher education, campus facilities, scholarship/financing opportunities, etc.

You are correct.

I like the path Warp is on as it makes sense to me. He certainly understands the workings of a university better than I do. All I did was play hoops and fooze

Yikes

http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/ncaabk/con-man-steals-spotlight-as-informant-in-basketball-probe/ar-AAsy4Xc?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=ientp

D.B. Cooper wrote

Rules should be changed but students shouldn't get paid for college athletics.  If you take the value of a 4-year scholarship vs. financing that education, you're looking at - what - half a million dollars of value?  Whether or not you, as a student athlete, study or make use of the education, that's up to you.

What should change in the students' favor is being able to switch schools at the end of the school year, on-campus food and residence and full benefits-style medical care while you are under scholarship.

If you start paying kids (legitimately), it will get really awful.

They should be getting paid for sports that make money. Making money with free labor is disgusting. When Alabama can pay  Outside Linebacker Coach Tosh Lupoi $950,000. per year, there is plenty of money at Alabama for the actual athletes we pay to watch. The Alabama 'official field' staff is paid a combined $18 million. Take $1million off that number and 100 football athletes could get $10,000.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/colleges/alabamas-outside-linebackers-coach-makes-more-than-the-university-president/2017/08/31/6d9fc4a8-8d8c-11e7-8df5-c2e5cf46c1e2_story.html?utm_term=.b3e1dce4a068

http://www.businessinsider.com/alabama-football-coaches-salaries-2017-2017-5

There is no such thing as a 4 year scholarship. The scholarship needs to be renewed each year. You can be dropped for many reasons including injury. The tuition cost to the University can actually placed at almost zero - adding a few more students into classes that are already scheduled costs nothing. The university owns athletes for 20 hours a week and that does not include "voluntary" practices, training/rehab/taping,  and no travel or only part of the travel. This is a part time job that sits on top of your academics.

Where do the basketball 1 and done athletes fit in? They are clearly not there to get an academic education as they are planning to leave after 1 season. They should be paid for their year of work.

Athletes are also not allowed to make money from anything having to do with their sport. A D2 pitcher I know was offered a job to give pitching lessons part time at a baseball training facility. It would have paid him $25 an hour for 20 hours a week. Because of NCAA rules, he was not allowed to take the job. He needs money to help pay for school so he had to take a much lower paying job flipping burgers for longer hours that cut into his summer training. These rules do not exist for any other non-athletic or academic scholarships like music, computer programming, art, and in fact you are encouraged to get positions in your scholarship field. Coaching sports seems to be a legitimate way to earn a lucrative living, yet those who are might be inclined to choose coaching as a vocation are not allowed to work in the field.

The NCAA is basically a criminal cartel that uses free labor to enrich itself and its members.