Need snow tires or are brand new tires good enough

Studs? Who uses em?  They'd never work for me with the highway miles I log every winter.

I've been ignoring the fact that I need to solve this problem, and this thread has brought it back top of mind.

If the women folk didn't have soo much luggage, I'd leave the car the bottom of the drive and walk up when necessary, and take my chances with storm chasing.

Sigh...

Nokian WR G3
I tried a set of these- which are supposedly a snow rated tire that can be left on all year (snow tire design- harder rubber+silica for ice grip). (Maybe I had the previous G2 model). Anyway,  put on  for the first snow season- just fine. Left on in summer, got half way through the 2nd winter season and had problems in my driveway- looked at the front tires and the middle was pretty much bald- about 22,000 miles on them.
Loved the idea, hated the results.

We can thank our government for those stooopid TPMS lights

All they do is cost us more money ----- aparently the government doesn't think we can tell when we have a soft/flat tire

No, not really. We can thank stupid consumers who drive huge SUVs and never check their tire pressure, and when they inevitably roll over in certain situations (because they roll over in a lot of situations) and cause damage to property and lives, they hire ambulance chasing class action lawyers to blame the car and tire companies for their own laziness and stupidity. And win, of course.

Aren't we talking about the same thing??? LOL

AWD Element with all season radials, works great; no problems whatsoever for this fulltime Blueline resident. Dedicated snows and studs work too, but really, are borderline conspicuous consumption.

bean valley wrote

 borderline conspicuous consumption.

Someday, and, the moment is rare in most lives, you are going to be traveling too fast than the rules of physics allow, but, you won't know until you have to stop quickly. Very quickly. That's when you're going to exhale and say to yourself, thank you, [fill in name of snow tire here], thank you.

I think I see that situation pretty often as a rural mail carrier. Still happy with my all season radials.

What Benny said.

Today was a good example. Just below freezing, wet snow on wet roads, temps dropping > flash freeze. The Hakkas ruled and even I was cautious. Your all-seasons? Skidsville, man.

Come on SBR - Hinterlandians have the opposite discussion - snows year round or switch to all seasons for the 1 month of "Summer"?

No question Benny's post rings true. I believe I am often beyond the limits of adhesion (is that even a word).

I don't think snows really help on ice.  

I do remember one time realizing I was driving across black ice very late at night (seeing several cars backwards of the side of the road). I really didn't see any option but to continue on. It was midnight and Zelda was pregnant and I crept along at 15 miles per hour back to Harvey Road.  When we got to the big hill, I knew we'd never get up, so I parked in a neighbor's driveway and decided to walk up the road.

I immediately went down when I stepped out of the car. We grabbed ski poles out of the back and walked up. I'll never forget thinking.... how the hell did those tires stay attached to the road? They weren't snows and I don't think snows would have been any better.

With regard to descending our driveway (in snow not ice) I've slipped my way down plenty with snows and without.  If it's slick I send someone (Zelda:) down to make sure no cars are coming.

Hell yeah!  I'm changing my nom de plume to 'Skidsvilleman'!

Snow tires are "conspicuous consumption"?  Good grief, if you don't want, or think you need, snows on your current rig than fine but please.  Nobody ever bought snow tires to show off.  That is a really odd comment.  Like claiming someone upgraded their septic tank to keep up with the Jonses.

Noah makes a good point.

Harvey wrote

No question Benny's post rings true. I believe I am often beyond the limits of adhesion (is that even a word).

I don't think snows really help on ice.  

....

I respectfully and totally disagree. It may be nit-picking but we should change the topic of discussion to "winter tires" instead of "snow tires." As with skis, there are a wide range of choices for different performance characteristics. Some are better at plowing through snow and slush, others (like my beloved Hakkas or the Michelin X-Ice) are more oriented towards traction on ice. And then there are studded tires, which excel on ice but are illegal where I live (strange but true). Just like skis, you make your choice and accept compromises, though are limited to a "one-tire quiver." I will admit that the Hakkas kind of suck in slush, as they tend to be a bit floaty, which can be kind of unnerving. But then the AWD and Subaru VDC are there to back you up. The VDC takes some getting used to but it has saved my butt a few times.

x10003q wrote

Come on SBR - Hinterlandians have the opposite discussion - snows year round or switch to all seasons for the 1 month of "Summer"?

You're not that far off. I usually run the winter tires from November to May - that's half the year! Though I would suspect that my situation is similar to those living in NoNY or NoVT.

I'll chime in here...being a huge Subaru enthusiast (have had 10+ and climbing), and living in NJ making the typical weekend trips up(M-F Job scenario) and the occasional "sick" days to exted the weekend, I definately log some highway miles from NJ-->LP and Gore.  Ever since I was old enough to start driving up instead of my dad who always did it since my brothers and I were 3 y/o, it was always in a AWD Subaru, first a 98 Outback, then 04 WRX, and now it will be a 01 Outback.

Had an issue in my 04 WRX back in 2010 that left me sliding onto some concrete-like snow on the side of the road with a dented auto trans pan, and a broken wire on one of the seleniods.  Had to drive home 320 miles in 2nd gear, which was real fun.  Tires were POS all seasons that previous owner had on the car.

Ever since that incident, I've run snows (have a sperate wheel/tire set to swap out in winter).  Do I need them, probably not since 75% of the drive is up the northway which is usually plowed. However, they've definately helped out on occasion when the road is bad enough, and it's cheap enough to make a winter tire set for your subi to just do it for the hell of it.

Building an 01 outback winter/ski car right now, just got done with a manual trans rebuild, about to do new tie rods, timing belt, some other maintenance.  Got a new set of General Altimax Arctics on steelies mounted and balanced ready to roll for winter.  Heard good things about these tires, so we'll see.  Only like $88/each.

I<3ADK wrote

Do I need them, probably not since 75% of the drive is up the northway which is usually plowed. However, they've definately helped out on occasion when the road is bad enough, and it's cheap enough to make a winter tire set for your subi to just do it for the hell of it.

Then there are those times, driving north from NJ, when you're going 300+ miles through a storm, and there's an inch or two of snow, or snow mixed with freezing rain….

FWIW the wife bought General snow tires with a tread that's a near 100% knock off of the Hakkas for her Prius.  Don't know about material composition but she got thru last winter OK.

Peter Minde wrote

I<3ADK wrote

Do I need them, probably not since 75% of the drive is up the northway which is usually plowed. However, they've definately helped out on occasion when the road is bad enough, and it's cheap enough to make a winter tire set for your subi to just do it for the hell of it.

Then there are those times, driving north from NJ, when you're going 300+ miles through a storm, and there's an inch or two of snow, or snow mixed with freezing rain….

FWIW the wife bought General snow tires with a tread that's a near 100% knock off of the Hakkas for her Prius.  Don't know about material composition but she got thru last winter OK.

Yeh, and there are many times when I look forward to that situation where the roads are bad all the way from NJ up, so I can say to myself that I'm glad I spent the money on the winter tires...makes them feel worth it...hate the feeling of snow tires on dry pavement for the majority of the drive.

1<3ADK.  You will like the Altimax Arctic set up. I live in the central Adirondacks and have them on on all wheel drive toyota, they are excellent in the snow, ice and slush. Have had them for 4 yrs, on steel rims, usually mount them up mid to late Nov and take them off mid to late March. Put them on for the season yesterday. Just watch when you are putting them on since they are directional tires, you don't want them on rotating the wrong way, that would be bad. Trust me.
     And after 4 yrs they still have plenty of tread left, should get another 3 seasons at least at the rate they are wearing.

I am here to admit that this is when I pay the piper without my snows.



Of course I have NEITHER snow tires, nor new all seasons. I have 3 year old all season tires.

Doh!

Here is the answer if you think AWD with all season tires is good enough:
http://jalopnik.com/lets-settle-the-winter-tires-vs-all-wheel-drive-debat-1462180324
If you don't want snow tires because you think you spend too much time in dry pavement, read this:
http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-reviews/winter-tires-track-tested
The hardest thing abut winter driving is passing all the boneheads who don't think they need proper tires.

Mm