ORDA mountains with kids -- advice wanted

Hi all -- this is a great ski blog that I've been lurking around for a while.  Kudos to Harvey and all the others who have made this a vibrant forum for NY skiers.

I'd like the advice of folks who have skied with kids at the ORDA mountains -- particularly with dealing with the off-mountain set up, arrival times, etc.  I've been bringing my three girls to Catamount for the past 4 years or so.  This year I purchased the Ski3 pass and have planned road trips to Whiteface (staying at Crowne Plaza between Xmas and New year's) and Gore (president's day weekend), and Belleayre will be the home mountain.  I am pretty pumped for Gore, especially.  Never been to any of them.

At Catamount, on all days except a few holidays we'd get there shortly after the lifts opened to little or no crowds.  The lodges were pretty informal, if somewhat grubby, affairs -- a lot of families brought their lunches, they have open cubbies to stash your stuff, folks are pretty accommodating in making room at a table when it gets crowded.  At times there is literally sh*t all over the floor in terms of bags, coolers etc.  The Catamount crowd is pretty exclusively families who (my sense is) want to avoid the Hunter/Windham/Vermont crowds, monied scene, rich teenagers, college kids, etc. and could accept the general shabbiness of Catamount.  We'd leave our skis outside on the racks and our bags in the cubbies generally without fear of theft.  Overall, it was an easy place to bring the girls and a positive experience.

Is it the same vibe at the ORDA mountains?  Are the staff cool with bringing your own lunch (two of the girls have allergies so it is easier and safer)?  Do you recommend renting a locker for our bags while we are out on the mountain?  Any other general advice for the skiing with the kiddies?  They are high beginner/low intermediate.  

Also, one final question -- my oldest daughter is doing ski club as a high school freshman.  The club moderator has suggested sending the kids with "ski locks" -- has anyone ever done this?  I didn't even know they exist.

Thanks in advance,
Petronio

No kids here, but have taken a few family friends kids to Gore a few times.  

Both Whiteface and Gore have bag hooks everywhere.  At Gore, no one uses lockers.  There is a bag check if your into that kind of thing.  

Gore has a ton of tables in multiple rooms.  I'm a midweek only skier so nearly everyone midweek brown bags it.  Gore does not care... nor does whiteface.  Personally, I like Gores lodge better, it has many more tables.  Whiteface only has one room that they cram everyone into.  Both Lodges are clean.  

One tip for ya, go downstairs at Gore, there is a large room down there that is usually nearly empty.  You don't get a view, but you do get a table all to yourself.  

Ski locks is a debatable thing.  Personally, even midweek at Gore I lock my stuff up.  I have never heard of a theft there, but I don't have the cash to replace my gear so I lock it.  My wife and I both leave our bags on hooks in the lodge (if someone wants my shoes and a pair of backup years old stinky gloves... have at).  We actually pretty regularly throw our cooler backpack on and haul it up to Saddle lodge.  We throw it on the hooks in the morning, stop for lunch, and pick it up on the last run.  You can always find a table up there and it really breaks up the day nicely.  

Both mountains are laid out rather well for beginners.  At Gore you can ski off the Gondolla or Sunway chair all day and have fun.  You can go up top and have even more fun.  And if your really adventurous head over to Burnt Ridge or into the trees.  At Whiteface, the higher you go the better it gets.  

Most importantly.... if you enjoy Gore... don't tell your friends!

Whiteface perspective.

Not unexpectedly, Christmas week is going to be one of the busiest weeks of the year at Whiteface. Having said that, if you plan accordingly, you shouldn't have any problems. First and foremost, arrive early ... it's that simple. If you get there before 8:30, you'll have no problem finding a place to put your gear. Personally, I never lock anything up, and (knock wood), I've never had a problem. If you get there early, you shouldn't have any problem finding a spot along the windows in the main cafeteria to put your stuff.

As far as bag lunching it, that's no problem either. You can sit in the main cafeteria with it and no one will give you any problem. The only place in the main lodge where they don't allow food to be brought in from the outside is in the Cloudspin Lounge (the bar).

Next, plan your breaks intelligently. All of the ski programs take a mid-morning break in the mid-station lodge at around 10:30, so that's not the place to be between 10:15 and 11:15. Any other time of day, it will be fine. As for lunch, if you can, avoid the main cafeteria between 11:30 and 1:00, and once again, you'll be very happy. That's not to say you won't get a table at the busy times, but to avoid having to really work for one, just use some good common sense.

As for locking up your skis, I've never done it. If you're really paranoid about it, simply separate your skis onto different racks.

Have a great time and hope for good weather!

I have been skiing whiteface with children for years.  We always head over to Kiddie Campus and use that as a place to put on our boots and gear and store our stuff for the day.  The walk from the parking lot is shorter and its less crowded.   Then we hike up about 300 yards and take the trail over to the main mountain.  We tend to leave placid by 8 and have no problem getting there, unloading the gear and getting dressed and being on the Gondi between 830 and 845.

We carry a back pack filled with food and beverage and leave it at the mid mountain lodge.  There is decent crepes and other things down stairs.

Like the others said, plan wisely.  If you eat at noon, you will wait.  If you eat at 1130 or 130, you wont.

Ski school is typically in the Mid Mtn Lodge between 10:15 and 10:30....its not crowded though.

I have never used a locker....rarely see anything locked up.

Have fun though at all three mountains.  They are all fun places.  

Thanks to all for your helpful advice -- appreciate it!

Petronio

Christmas week is the busiest week by far.  Space will be a commodity for sure.   The crowd during Christmas holiday can approach 5,000 which is easily 3500 more than non-holidays.  So, your Whiteface experience will be different from normal….

That said be an hour ahead of the crowd and you will avoid most of the holiday over crowdedness.  Show up 7:45 and space will be available.  

Take advantage of base lodge drop off zone.  Drive across bridge to unload kids and gear at base lodge and then one parent drive back to hopefully the River Lot.  Makes life easier.  Once dropped off bring skis through the “tunnel” to ski racks on slope side of lodge.  You can also drive up to base lodge at end of day for pick up.  

The Base Lodge “basecamp” area is located on second floor. It has a very open floor plan and is spacious.  Basecamp includes the main cafeteria, plus two rooms with plenty of tables and a kick arse fireplace.  However, it does fill up during the holiday so taking an early lunch say starting between 10:50-11:10ish be a good plan.
 
Another idea would be to use basecamp to dress in the morning and bring a small backpack with your lunch and extra gear up the face lift. From top of facelift, it’s an easy ski right to mid lodge.  Lots of backpack hooks and tables at mid station.  It is also generally less crowded.    

Most important thing is not to take standard lunch break.  Avoid 11:30-1:30 if possible.

Kids Campus is awesome for families.  However, depending on family age and ability, it may not be the right fit.  Kids campus trail system is aimed toward little kids.  The base lodge is beautiful but much smaller.  The trail system does connect to main mtn but you could miss connector trail from the main mountain.  If you do that after last chair you will need to take crowded shuttle back to Kids Campus.  I also hear it’s quite crowded on holidays, so you may want to avoid that scene.

As far as family skiing at WF, if conditions happen to be firm it would be very wise to make sure skis are properly tuned.  Start off your day skiing Facelift and/or Bear chair.  Most terrain from these lifts are beginner to intermediate.  If comfortable head up Gondola.  Excelsior is best intermediate option.  It does see significant skier traffic during holidays so it is crowded and can become firm in some locations.  

Approach off the top leads to fairly steep expert trails.  If groomed lower Mackenzie access from approach to 2200 road to 1900 road is a nice intermediate trail.  

On Summit Parons is intermediate and from Look Out Wilmington is intermediate conditions depending.    
Whiteface region is an awesome place to spend the holiday.  So many really fun family off hill activities here!  

Here’s hoping for a white Christmas holiday at our beloved WF!!

I have written several blog posts on this topic.  Several of them were more related to getting young kids started and some speed control concept that help parents with lower level kids.

It sounds as if your kids are older but this post I think is still relevant to having a good holiday with your kids.

http://nyskiblog.com/coach-z-ski-vacations-with-kids/

Once on this post you can check out my other instructional posts by clicking on Coach Z at the top of the post and scrolling thru the posts.

I think that one of the best things about skiing is sharing it with my son.  Skiing is one of the very few sports where 2 or 3 generations of a family can enjoyably participate in a sport together.  That time skiing and riding a chair is very special.  Ski Magazine just devoted an entire issue to this topic and I thought it was of their best issues ever.

I've skied gore with kids for quite a few years during holiday periods. I agree with previous posters that the vibe will be similar to Catamount. SOme thoughts based on my experience:

Getting to the hill early is always good. If you have to lug a lot of stuff and arrive a little late consider the "premium" parking for $10.00.

I always sit downstairs and usually bring lunch. I've found that 11:30 generally works well for finding space.

I do not use a locker and do not lock my skiis. But I don't have expensive racing skiis.

The gore snow school is well regarded. When my kids were younger I found that the multi day lessons really tought my kids a lot.

Try to avoid the base area during peak ski times (10:30-12:00 and 1:00-2:30). The gondola line and even the tripple can have long lines (for gore, not Vermont long).

By Tuesday of presidents week the really big crowds will be gone.

tom

My 2 cents in Gore.  If it is very windy, don't ride the Adirondack Express no matter how long the Gondola line is.  It can be brutally and sometimes dangerously cold and windy at the the top.  Avoid the Sunway lift as well, it is super slow and its line can be longer than the Gondola line.  The Gondola and the Adirondack Express serve all the terrain it serves, so you aren't missing out on any terrain.  As for terrain, I highly recommend the cruisers in the Northwoods area and Burnt Ridge.  I enjoy it every time I am there and spend most of my day in those areas.  The Ski Bowl is also fun, but it is seldom open (hopefully that will change).  I would also recommend the north side.  Although it is served by a painfully slow lift, the trails are really nice and there is never a line, even on the busiest days.  If you read this blog a lot you will see how much everyone likes the Gore summit.  I personally do not like it much since it is usually a bit icy and the lifts are slow.  There will also be an annoying traverse at the top of the Straightbrook lift and on Lower Cloud when you leave.  If you do go to the summit, then keep in mind that the barrier to bringing any kid to the summit is nothing on the summit itself.  It is the approach on Pine Knot.  It used to be rated a blue and that has been changed to a black.  It is double fall line, high traffic, windswept, and icy.  It can easily be avoided by accessing the High Peaks chair via Wood in, but that is another one of Gore's annoying traverses.  I think that Gore is the best ORDA mountain for a family with kids that are intermediates, and I know that you will enjoy it.

Things do get stolen at Gore, but not often. FYI, some ski locks have longer cables and are much easier to use.

Face is great for beginners. Kid's campus has a chair lift and there's two bottom chair lifts by the main lodge that are great for newbs. If you park at kids kampus as someone above suggested, you can ski over to the main area and back, there's connecting trails, check to make sure they're open.

The Ski3 pass seems to be catching on. Speaking of which, wonder if Aussie got one?

Snowballs wrote

The Ski3 pass seems to be catching on. Speaking of which, wonder if Aussie got one?

My beer almost came out my nose when I saw that!!!

FYI did our first day at Gore today.  We were supposed to get up here Thursday night but over 18" in Poughkeepsie stopped that plan in its tracks.  We didn't get here until about 4:00 on Friday.  And due to an unforseen snag in my wife's work schedule, we have to be back in Pok before Monday morning despite my booking the rental through the long weekend (next time I will check with her before booking!).

But, putting aside the stay 2/pay for 4 night special I am getting for the rented condo, we had a great day on the mountain today.  I can't get over that despite the crowds at the base lodge and the cars parked all the way down the side of the access road, the mountain was almost never crowded.  The gondola line moved quickly when we got on it around 9:00 (the close-in parking was full by then, but we somehow snagged an empty spot within 100 yards of the lodge).  We spent the morning on the North Side, starting on the Loop and Pete Gay, and moving over to Sleeping Bear and Tahawus.  The North Quad was basically ski-on except for about an hour right before lunch.  Went down to the base lodge for lunch at a poor time -- around 12:15 -- but the girls were having a great time and didn't want an early break.

They did not like Sunway -- crowded, scraped bare in spots and bumpy in others -- but we only were on it to get back down to the base.  Took the gondola back up at about 1 and again a quick moving line. I offered the girls a trip to the summit via High Peaks chair but they wanted to stick with the North Side again.  Left the mountain around 3:45.

Staying in a rented condo at The Summit.  Nice, clean unit, nicely decorated, with updated kitchen and batch.  A little expensive but pretty convenient and cozy.  We ate at Basil & Wick's Friday night -- very friendly, and very accommodating with the girls' food allergies -- and cooked in tonight.

It's going to be pretty darn cold and a little windy tomorrow, with wind chills of around 20 below -- I won't take them out in that kind of weather.  They get too cold too fast and it is just not fun for them.  Maybe we will go snow tubing and take a walk down Main Street in North Creek.

Thumbs up from me and all the girls on Gore.  Can't wait to see the rest of the mountain.

Petronio