RCR joins EPIC pass

https://www.epicpass.com/

Well that answers the question of where 6 of the old maxpass mountains are going next year. Makes EPIC way more appealing for me.

Will ORDA join in with one of the options or go it alone?

Vail also started a long-term agreement with Telluride, which pulled it away from the Mountain Collective.  The other addition to Epic that Aussies are talking about is Hakuba in Japan moving from the MCP to Epic.  Telluride and Hakuba provide a limited number of days, no discount for additional days.

Wow Epic in one swoop just took over control of Canada skiing

That just leaves what they are going to do in the East.  If they are doing the route like in Canada where they don't buy the ski area but sell passes that would be super sweet if Orda got on the Epic train.  

Kudos to them for the Military Epic pass that is really a great thing for them to do for our Military.

Zero chance ORDA joins Epic.  I don't think they'd partner with any ski area that couldn't open all their lifts by Christmas if their life depended on it.

I think Triple Peaks getting in on this like RCR and Telluride did makes sense.

I still won't consider Epic over Ikon until they get more eastern mountains.

ORDA 3  are on the MaxPass

Max Pass is toast next year if you're following the industry news.

snoloco wrote

Zero chance ORDA joins Epic.  I don't think they'd partner with any ski area that couldn't open all their lifts by Christmas if their life depended on it.

I think Triple Peaks getting in on this like RCR and Telluride did makes sense.

I hope your joking around because that’s the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard you say. You know who didn’t have all their lifts open by Christmas this season? Lots but here’s two- Vail and Telluride!

Apples to oranges.  While weather is definitely a factor here in the east, it is even more of a factor out west since you not only need cold, but also need consistent snowfall to open all your lifts.  And I'm sure if you looked at the majority of years, Vail has all their lifts open by Christmas.

I don't really know what amount of Vail's business is actually focused on the skiing product, but the fact that Stowe is making snow right now is a good sign.  Surely that's better than ORDA going over budget on the Whiteface lodge construction dumpster fire and having to take money from the snowmaking budget to finish it, which will likely result in Whiteface closing in March.  Seems like such a great idea to sacrifice making snow to build a lodge that replaced a perfectly good existing one, when snow is the very medium the sport exists upon.  Especially in a warming and unpredictable climate.

 so which mountains are bad and which are good

I've never skied a Vail mountain although I'm sure I will at some point.  From what I've heard there are things I do and don't like.

I like the lift investment pretty much equally among all the resorts (not obviously favoring one over the others), skiing focus (not all about real estate), epic pass price, and now commitment to keeping the season going into spring with snowmaking at Stowe.

What I don't like is lift ticket prices, charging for all parking, food/drink prices, and excessive speed enforcement.  I've also heard they try and run every mountain the same but I don't really get what this means.

snoloco wrote

Zero chance ORDA joins Epic.  I don't think they'd partner with any ski area that couldn't open all their lifts by Christmas if their life depended on it.

Stupid statement. I seem to remember everyone saying ORDA would never join the MAX pass either.

For someone who seems to be so informed about the ski industry you should know that MANY mountains both east and west don't have all lifts by Christmas. I can tell you for certain that MSA didn't have panorama (their "signature" expert area) open by Christmas last season. Pretty sure Fernie didn't have all lifts at Xmas either. I doubt that all of Vail's ski areas out west had all lifts open this year since it was a low snow year in Colorado and Utah and those resorts have comparatively little snow making by terrain percentage than areas in the east. I've skied Park City in January when much of the lower mountain was brown with only main trails open on snow making. Does it matter if all lifts are running but only a handful of trails are open?

ORDA mountains would make absolute sense for EPIC to go after Ikon in the east. With only Stowe they have a gaping hole in the east. I agree they would have to up their game, but Bell would give them a mountain close to NY metro. Gore would give them a mountain to compete with southern VT mountains  and WF would give them a signature eastern expert mountain that doesn't directly compete with Stowe's core customer base (boston based skiers).

Epic has to do something else in the East. My money is that they buy Jay in May or whenever the receiver sells. That still leaves the NYC/NJ market with a 6+ hour ride to use the pass in the east.

snoloco wrote

I've never skied a Vail mountain although I'm sure I will at some point.  From what I've heard there are things I do and don't like.

I like the lift investment pretty much equally among all the resorts (not obviously favoring one over the others), skiing focus (not all about real estate), epic pass price, and now commitment to keeping the season going into spring with snowmaking at Stowe.

What I don't like is lift ticket prices, charging for all parking, food/drink prices, and excessive speed enforcement.  I've also heard they try and run every mountain the same but I don't really get what this means.

Vail Mountain has installed 10 new high speed lifts in the last 11 years. Without relying solely on real estate, which they also are involved in, they need to charge $199 for a day ticket, parking, etc. The money needs to come from somewhere. High speed chairs and gondolas are expensive, and require more than simply selling $899 season passes.

BTW, Vail is my favorite mountain. You need to experience it, snoloco.