Can you be liable for colliding with someone?

Please read the story in the attached link. This guy is running for NYS Supreme Court. He may have the right to an insurance claim under our system, however he does not have the right to intimidate my son. Please vote wisely and ski or board safely!  Thank you.

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Saratoga-judge-s-ski-injury-case-chills-teenage-3390297.php

In this case, the SYSTEM really should be put on trial.

That judge is a huge jerk and probably a horrible skier. No one wants to get hit on snow, but he is taking it way too far. Maybe your son owes him an assist in cutting the grass or something, but a lien on the house? Incredible. Aren't judges elected? Politics are forbidden here, but I certainly hope this backfires and a less litigious dem, green, lib, or anarchist gets the chair.

Best of luck (and I hope your son really did learn a lesson about being in control, too)

:)

Thank you.  My son tried to stop when the Judge made an unexpected turn...he had his foot off the board trying to stop and they both fell upon colliding. I'm not upset about how our system works, I just don't like how the Judge lost his cool and started screaming at my son (then a minor). In my opinion, the City Judge should not be a NYS Supreme Court Judge. We were lucky my son did not get hurt. Most people (like us) did not realize someone could come after you after a collision on the slopes because it is a risky sport to begin with (unless someone is acting with intent or negligence). We are hoping for some Judge-karma.

Donzilla welcome.  

(Your link above should be live now, it's a switch I have to flick - it's an attempt to frustrate spammers selling sunglasses or whatever).

This story got some attention in the forum last March:

http://forum.nyskiblog.com/Saratoga-judge-s-ski-injury-case-chills-teenage-snow-boarder-Times-Union-td3810487.html#a3811275

My own two cents is that the downhill rule is the only simple, logical way to manage traffic on the hill.  I have to admit that I flipped out on a kid who clocked my five year old on Sunway last season. But I didn't sue him.

This does seem a little over the top. I think the lawn mowing thing sounds right.  

I guess if it's REALLY a life long injury that makes a difference. In a case like this is there anyway to prove that the guy had a torn rotator and whatever else?

what am i missing here. your son hit someone and injured him. the injured person yelled at him. i've been clocked from behind several times. the sudden shock is stunning. profanities followed as soon as i got my bearings. whether you like it or not, your son was the uphill skier and was responsible for avoiding the downhill skier.

frk wrote

 whether you like it or not, your son was the uphill skier and was responsible for avoiding the downhill skier.

Pretty much true. I feel like there are SOME exceptions to this, but I wasn't there to see it so I'm not one to judge. Heh, get it? judge? Forget it....

From what I HAVE read, It sounds like he was trying to straight line past the guy and the guy turned into him. Especially difficult with the terrible blind spot snowboarders have. Some reaming out was probably called for. Suing? Definitely not. I think what pisses me off the most about this is that he mentioned that he probably wouldn't have sued if he didn't know that insurance would just pay it out.

Liability:   I did not check but in the article an attorney said the burden. Was " wanton" disregard.    That is much higher Level than simple negligence... duty owed and breached.    .   I would find the limited facts to give no liability for wanton disregard.   If there were no witnesses,  its a "he said she said" and the boy seems like an apologetic witness.   Jury would likely go his way...my 2 cents.

Reality:   the insurer will settle.  There are injuries with bills. Not saying they are legit, but he went to the hospital.  Old injuries or no injuries are very, very hard to prove from a "defense" point of view, especially soft tissue and or pain.   But a torn rotator is easy to see.     NY or this county may have a high jury threshold (10k?) to meet before you can get to a jury.  So likely this will be in front of a judge only.  I would not go to trial in front of a judge that knows this plaintiff.  Jury yes.  Scapula and rotator are about $3000 add physical therapy and you have $5000, assuming he runs the bills if he's looking for a pay day.   52 yo skier will not fully recover from a torn rotator....I know, sadly.  Does not matter in the law if this injury happened before this alleged new tear to  his rotator. If it was reinjured...the person who reinjured owns the whole injury,  as stupid as that is.     He likely has free counsel via his friends.    So he can drag it out and play legal games.   If the insurer is smart.  True there is  low or limited liability, but they will have a huge defense bill and still settle 3 years  from now.  Settle quick.    I predict a 15k settlement that will never be published.   But, would be nice if we had some follow-up on this.       The loser Judge  can take a few trips out west and get a few season passes for his pain.  I just hope it was real.  

NOTE:  Edited, to make it easier to read.   I got to get an app to help make the forum more user friendly.    Impossible to read or edit when posting from a droid.  

Ski in control or risk being sued.   Sad but its life.   Is rather see this judge get some cash for this injury than the 1000s of mild fender benders that occur everyday and build meds to get their cAsh.... a practice that seems 100% acceptable in society now.    Go into any PT clinic and see the leaches doing exercises that could be easily done at home.....all in a. Effort to have Med bills.   No Med bills no settlement.  

Must be a tough dude not to feel any pain until later in the day

•The person will hold the arm connected to the injured scapula close to the body.
•Movement of the arm will increase the scapular pain.
•The person will be unable to lift the arm connected to the fractured scapula.
•The person may have pain with each deep breath due to movement of the chest wall with each breath. This movement may cause movement of the broken shoulder blade causing pain.
•The person's shoulder with the fractured scapula may appear flattened or deformed

Tears that happen suddenly, such as from a fall, usually cause intense pain. There may be a snapping sensation and immediate weakness in your upper arm.

The kid was in the wrong for hitting someone below him - that is clear but in this case the Judge is a leach on the system.  Anyone that knows about this incident and then votes for this bozo is crazy.

Shakesphere was right - "kill all the lawyers"

Just looked up what bone the scapula is....I was wrongly thinking it was another name for the clavical.  Rather its a huge bone under the clavical, think a triangle that sits on a vertical plain--its that chicken wing you see on skinny kids backs.  :)     I wondered because of the conversation regarding symptoms and pain.   My buddy broke his clavical 4 yrs ago.   Major pain....32, plays hockey and drinks--alot.    He did it friday night but did not go to the hospital until the weekend was over.    He could not move his arm both immediatley after the accident or 36 hrs later..period.   That said, all injuries have different severities.   I would trust an x-ray that would show a fractured scapula as being the first injury and caused by this accident.   Medical literature says this bone usually does not break, unless on men between 35 and 45...when we become arm-chair quarterbacks.    Major trauma is the source.   That would fit right in with a torn rotator.    


Also...it does say major pain.  So if it did occur, he was in pain and should get trip and a few ski passes. I dont have a problem with it.     He could have a high pain threshold, been feeling the adreneline and been in deep denial.     It happens.    


Or....maybe the judge went tree skiing afterwards and met up with an oak.    That would cause a broken scapula too.   Defense:  Ask to see his coat in discovery.    Test it for embedded cellulose or get retired detective Furman to plant  some.   :)    

the collision and injury occurred very early in season ( december i think) so there was no tree skiing. if this judge slipped on your poorly maintained sidewalk, i don't think anyone would be questioning his insurance claim. i have no qualms having him compensated for an injury and i hope that the compensation acts like a deterrence too. i think that we all have experienced skiing a crowded blue square on a weekend/holiday and be overrun by endless streams of mostly young males 14-25 going about 2-3x the speed of the rest of the skiers weaving in and out. It's like the bronx-queens expressway with knucklehead drivers weaving in and out at rush hour. they will cause an accident. also, if this guy wasn't a lawyer, would there be an uproar?

I agree, my son is responsible for avoiding the downhill skier. We have witnesses that say the Judge turned into my son's path. According to my insurance company, both parties share the responsibility. A person skiing or boarding on the mountain assumes some risk just by being there - especially on opening day with limited narrow trails and too many people.  The insurance company expects to settle as well - will it be a 40/60 split? - who knows...
...

Donzilla23 wrote

I agree, my son is responsible for avoiding the downhill skier. We have witnesses that say the Judge turned into my son's path. According to my insurance company, both parties share the responsibility. A person skiing or boarding on the mountain assumes some risk just by being there - especially on opening day with limited narrow trails and too many people.  

This is the sort of thinking I imagine sloshing around in a lot of heads sliding down mountains. It's why I don't dare ski Thanksgiving weekend anywhere in the East.

Six figure demand.   Using out of legal context but....


Res ispa loquitor.


   

PS.   Tree skiing quip was just that. Wow.

We can all learn something from this.  We need to insure ourselves against this sort of thing.  A million $$$ liability policy doesn't cost that much when added to our homeowners and auto policies.  

Today is a good day to check your insurance policy and add coverage for situations like this.  

BTW if you ever need to get an attorney for such a lawsuit, it is best to consult your insurance company before you get the attorney.  Sometimes, the insurance will provide one and other times they will pay for yours, if they approve it first.  It happened to a friend of mine this summer over a dog fight.  I'll tell you the story on the lift someday.  It will scare the hell out of you when you learn what a litigious liar can do to you over a triviality.  

Insurance.  Don't say I didn't warn you.

My guess is that being a Judge/from a lawyer family and knowing the legal system, he figured he could get at least 5 or 6 figures from a lawsuit. Beyond that, he knows that it will never go to court since the insurance companies prefer to settle rather than risk an even larger payout coupled with the cost of lawyers time.

Can't really blame him for that. You can blame him though for being an asshole at the scene of the accident. I have noticed that skiiers tend to turn much sharper than snowboarders. It is unfortunate, because it seems both were riding under full control, just a bad split second judgement call.

I remember when I was learning to snowboard, I was more afraid of hurting someone else than myself even. I am easily twice the size of most kids, 3 times the size of some. When I saw a duck line of kids going by I would just wait 5 minutes until they were nowhere in my vicinity.

Good luck to you and your son, I am sure he will get over being gunshy in due time,  rapid rebound is one of the advantages of being young. Hopefully he has learned one of the most important lessons of snowboarding: stay the hell away from 50 year old skiers!

Donzilla23 wrote

I agree, my son is responsible for avoiding the downhill skier. We have witnesses that say the Judge turned into my son's path. According to my insurance company, both parties share the responsibility. A person skiing or boarding on the mountain assumes some risk just by being there - especially on opening day with limited narrow trails and too many people.  The insurance company expects to settle as well - will it be a 40/60 split? - who knows. The latest update we have is that the Judge asked for a six-figure settlement. The Insurance company denied it and made an offer that the Judge declined. They told us to not be surprised if he files a law suit after the election...

You assume the risks inherent in the sport, e.g., losing your edge when the snow turns icy during the day, hitting a tree in the glades, but you don't assume the risk of some else's negligence. When the insurance company says that "both parties share the responsibility," they mean that the material facts are in dispute. That's what a trial will settle. When the amount of damages dovetails with the expense of a trial, the insurer will settle. Although your rates may increase, any award won't come directly out of your pocket. Heightened caution when skiing on the WROD early in the season goes to the standard of care, but doesn't excuse a collision -- in other words, that's the time of the season that you need to slow down and give everyone else a lot of room. The "fact" that your son hit the person downhill from him does not bode well for your case. If I was your lawyer, I'd strongly recommend that you stop posting on this forum, because you've already said too much. If the judge refrained from considering a law suit until he found out you were covered by insurance, I wouldn't condemn him. On election day (I'm in his district), I'm voting against him not because of this, but because he seems to be a self-entitled dick, from a family of self-entitled dicks, who doesn't have the appropriate demeanor to be a Supreme Court justice. It seems that the judge may have suffered a serious injury, another "fact" that needs to be established. If it's as bad as he claims, he's entitled to compensation. Time to bite the bullet.

I guess I'm just a Dad looking out for his son...maybe we can get the Judge to donate his settlement to charity...he probably doesn't need the money...