Christmas holidays, intermediates, where to go?

Hunter and Windham will be mobbed.  

Pico has 2 HSQs.  Loco doesn't like them because they are not new and cushy.  The lower one services the lower blue terrain and the summit some harder blues and blacks.  Nice mt for cruising.  They have a mix of old fashioned narrow twisty trails and wide open cruisers.  Pico does have a limited water supply for snow making but If for some reason there is not enough snow Killington is 10 mins away.  There is on mt condos and some nice B&Bs around.  The Vt Inn is nice.

Don't know much about Burke but that there is very remote it so lodging dining après will be limited there if that is important to you.  That is also well over your 4 hr drive circle.

"Timid Lower Intermediate" should be read as "beginner", especially at a new mountain that the person doesn't know with holiday crowds and nervousness added in.

I agree with the Mt. Snow, Okemo, Pico, Gore line of thinking here. Just some place with relatively easy blues that has a lot of terrain.

And yes, you'll probably have more snowmaking at the VT places. But Gore does a good job of spreading crowds around because of its layout.

When Gore is fully open, it will spread the crowds out better than the rest will.  During Christmas, don't expect anything more than the front side, topridge, and straightbrook to be open.  The gondola had a 20-30 minute wait when I went in 12-13 and the mountain was fully open then.  If it is half open, I cannot imagine the chaos.  

This is the holidays, so anywhere you go is going to be mobbed, and I would much rather be at a place that crowded out when it was fully open than one that was half open.  One of my pet peeves is standing in a long lift line at a mountain that isn't running all their lifts, and I mean ALL their lifts for whatever reason.  I somewhat busted on Mount Snow in 2009 because they had crazy lines at many lifts, but there were 2 that weren't running.  I will likely not go there again except late season or midweek.

snoloco wrote

When Gore is fully open, it will spread the crowds out better than the rest will.  During Christmas, don't expect anything more than the front side, topridge, and straightbrook to be open.  The gondola had a 20-30 minute wait when I went in 12-13 and the mountain was fully open then.  If it is half open, I cannot imagine the chaos.

Yeah, you probably know the crowds at Gore better than people who ski the mountain 75+ days a year. Keep up the informative posting, person who named themself "loco".

I've skied gore over Christmas week for many years. It was never fully open and the crowds were always tolerable. And Gore's snowmaking has been improving.

In the cats, I think the tradeoff is snowmaking vs crowds. Bellayre snowmaking has not been great but it will be less crowed than either Hunter or Windham.

In Vermont, Pico is a nice mountain but their snowmaking is also marginal. Pico is a great choice later in the season but I'm not so sure about Christmas week.

If you are daytripping, I'd wait to make my decision based on how conditions are looking.If you need lodging, it's more risky waiting because the bargains will be sold out.

tom

Noah John wrote

snoloco wrote

There are four 6-packs that do 3,600 pph at 1,100 fpm.  What that means is even with big crowds, you get up the mountain fast.  

 Your love affair with high speed lifts is creepy.

snoloco wrote

I do not recommend Gore or Whiteface.  Both have insufficient snowmaking capacity and take till almost President's Day to fully open.  

This is your most inexperienced post to date.  It's not about capacity its about area and WF is huge.  WF has awesome snowmaking system and snow tribe kicks arse.  The amount of area WF can cover when weather conditions are optimal is mind blowing.  

Stick to posting about bubble lifts and stop offer inaccurate personal opinions about snow making when its obviously based on a significant lack of experience.  

Thanks for the input.  I think I'll tell my friend to consider Gore, Pico, Belleayre and Windham.  I don't know if they are thinking about a day trip or staying a night or two near the slopes.  Obviously, that's a big factor in whether or not they need to make a choice sooner rather than later.

I know Lake Placid and Whiteface well enough to know that makes little sense for this couple.  Maybe in a few years when they want to take a longer ski vacation but don't want to fly out west.  It's a long drive from Lake Placid back to the DC metro area.

marznc wrote

Thanks for the input.  I think I'll tell my friend to consider Gore, Pico, Belleayre and Windham.  I don't know if they are thinking about a day trip or staying a night or two near the slopes.  Obviously, that's a big factor in whether or not they need to make a choice sooner rather than later.

I know Lake Placid and Whiteface well enough to know that makes little sense for this couple.  Maybe in a few years when they want to take a longer ski vacation but don't want to fly out west.  It's a long drive from Lake Placid back to the DC metro area.

Out of these 4 options I say Gore if it is fully open, otherwise, Windham every time.

Wow Loco!

You really need to ski Gore more.  Much more.  Then perhaps you could offer others valid information about it.  Even if Gore were to only have the front-side open, it would offer just as much if not more ski-able terrain.  And much more interesting terrain at that.  

And don't worry about the Gondi line... we have a new high speed lift for you.  With padded seats.  No bubble though.  

CMR

P.s.  Just how many days have you skied at Gore?

CMR wrote

Wow Loco!
You really need to ski Gore more.  Much more.  Then perhaps you could offer others valid information about it.  Even if Gore were to only have the front-side open, it would offer just as much if not more ski-able terrain.  And much more interesting terrain at that.
And don't worry about the Gondi line... we have a new high speed lift for you.  With padded seats.  No bubble though.  
CMR

P.s.  Just how many days have you skied at Gore?

I would guess under 5 days. That would account for the "wealth" of knowledge.

I would suggest for a Christmas holiday of skiing with a low intermediate:

Stratton----base camp.    From there you can travel to Mt. Snow and maybe even Killington. Perhaps starting or ending in Albany, one could get a day at Gore in.     Make it a holiday.    



2 days Stratton,
1 day Mt Snow
1 day Gore.


Gear the trip toward the low intermediate.   There are lots of slopes at each of these for the higher level as well.    Keep mama happy.     Unless she does not want to travel, then stay at Stratton or Gore.    

I will put in my 2 cents as an intermediate who has skied Gore, Windham, Belleayre, Stratton and Catamount over the past 4 years.

Catamount will be too small for what your friends are looking for.  It's a local hill, not a destination.

Belleayre is nice mountain.  I've only skied it fully open with good conditions.  It's what I would call a "ridgeline" hill with steep trails set out from left to right across the ridge that run out at mid-mountain, with two long, lazy blues on either end of the ridge.  They have a lower set of trails aimed at beginners, which is where the kids' program is.  There is no on-mountain lodging, but there might be cozy places to stay in Margareteville or elsewhere nearby.  What is nice about Belleayre is that is has some very wide, straight-down steeper blues on the west side that can help the wife progress.  I had a trip report from last year:
http://forum.nyskiblog.com/Belleayre-Mountain-Ski-Center-NY-2-23-14-tp4037268.html

Windham is also a place that, IMO, offers a good mix for intermediates.  You get more of a "big mountain" sense than Belleayre, although honestly I don't know the comparative size.  Just basing that off my personal perceptions.  There is housing at the base if you wanted to try to find a rental condo.  

Stratton is a big mountain, but IMO much more crowded.  They can pump a lot of people up the hill in an hour.  There is a lot of housing at the base and also a number of condo complexes along the access road and further down the county road.  Stratton seems like a "see and be seen" kind of place.  However, if you stay at or near Stratton, you can also ski Bromley and there are outlet shops in Manchester if you into that kind of thing.  Also, you don't get the "wilderness feel" you get when skiing Gore or even Belleayre.

I'd recommend Gore.  We went twice last year and ended up renting a place for the season this year.  We stayed at Garnet Hill Lodge which I would highly recommend if you want that authentic Adirondack lodge experience.  (Not some kind of Disneyfied version with spa treatments, etc.)  Gore is big mountain -- we were there on one of the busiest weekends and rarely waited in a lift line.  The terrain is great and the vibe is mellow.  It's all about the skiing.

Petronio

Petronio wrote

Stratton is a big mountain, but IMO much more crowded.  They can pump a lot of people up the hill in an hour.

High Speed Quads in action.

Petronio wrote

We stayed at Garnet Hill Lodge which I would highly recommend if you want that authentic Adirondack lodge experience.

 Tell em NYSkiBlog sent ya!

x10003q wrote

CMR wrote

Wow Loco!
You really need to ski Gore more.  Much more.  Then perhaps you could offer others valid information about it.  Even if Gore were to only have the front-side open, it would offer just as much if not more ski-able terrain.  And much more interesting terrain at that.
And don't worry about the Gondi line... we have a new high speed lift for you.  With padded seats.  No bubble though.  
CMR

P.s.  Just how many days have you skied at Gore?

I would guess under 5 days. That would account for the "wealth" of knowledge.

But he did stay at a Holiday Inn Express the night before he went

Petronio wrote

I will put in my 2 cents as an intermediate who has skied Gore, Windham, Belleayre, Stratton and Catamount over the past 4 years.

Catamount will be too small for what your friends are looking for.  It's a local hill, not a destination.

Belleayre is nice mountain.  I've only skied it fully open with good conditions.  It's what I would call a "ridgeline" hill with steep trails set out from left to right across the ridge that run out at mid-mountain, with two long, lazy blues on either end of the ridge.  They have a lower set of trails aimed at beginners, which is where the kids' program is.  There is no on-mountain lodging, but there might be cozy places to stay in Margareteville or elsewhere nearby.  What is nice about Belleayre is that is has some very wide, straight-down steeper blues on the west side that can help the wife progress.  I had a trip report from last year:
http://nyskiblog.com/forums/#nabble-f2185909

Windham is also a place that, IMO, offers a good mix for intermediates.  You get more of a "big mountain" sense than Belleayre, although honestly I don't know the comparative size.  Just basing that off my personal perceptions.  There is housing at the base if you wanted to try to find a rental condo.  

Stratton is a big mountain, but IMO much more crowded.  They can pump a lot of people up the hill in an hour.  There is a lot of housing at the base and also a number of condo complexes along the access road and further down the county road.  Stratton seems like a "see and be seen" kind of place.  However, if you stay at or near Stratton, you can also ski Bromley and there are outlet shops in Manchester if you into that kind of thing.  Also, you don't get the "wilderness feel" you get when skiing Gore or even Belleayre.

I'd recommend Gore.  We went twice last year and ended up renting a place for the season this year.  We stayed at Garnet Hill Lodge which I would highly recommend if you want that authentic Adirondack lodge experience.  (Not some kind of Disneyfied version with spa treatments, etc.)  Gore is big mountain -- we were there on one of the busiest weekends and rarely waited in a lift line.  The terrain is great and the vibe is mellow.  It's all about the skiing.

Petronio

Thanks for the helpful summary!  Looks like Windham is slightly lower than Belleayre, but with a bit more vertical.  I know that Belleayre does not have top-to-bottom blue/black trails because of the layout.  Spent a day there exploring in late March last season when there was plenty of snow and almost no one around.  I liked it.  Windham has 278 skiable acres compared to Belleayre with 171.

I figure that with AEII installed at Gore, lift lines at the base won't be as bad as recent years during the holidays.  Gore is listed as 445 skiable acres.  But the downside to a bigger mountain for relative novices is that they may get frustrated trying to find their way around when they only have a day or two.  My friends have only been skiing at ski areas under 100 acres.  No need to look at a trail map when a place is that small.

marznc wrote

Thanks for the input.  I think I'll tell my friend to consider Gore, Pico, Belleayre and Windham.  I don't know if they are thinking about a day trip or staying a night or two near the slopes.  Obviously, that's a big factor in whether or not they need to make a choice sooner rather than later.

Wait wait wait,

If they're willing to make the trip 4 hours from Albany like I originally thought, all of my suggestions are in play. Despite what Coach thinks, Burke is sub 4, and not just because I'm the fastest driver on the road.

But why do they have to choose one place to ski for a few days? Any of these smaller places have other options nearby. I wouldn't advise 3 days at Windham when Belleayre and Plattekill are also viable for intermediates, especially when one would have to wait on lines during a holiday week.

Similarly, you could ski Oak and Tog with Greek. Those mountains are of a similar scale to what they're used to but it's still an opportunity to hang out in NY.

The larger mountains offer a bit more vert for the drive. Pico doesn't have the best snowmaking, but it wouldn't be hard to tie in a day to Killington or the Snow Bowl from there just to mix it up.

I guess it depends on what they're looking for in terms of other stuff to do. I'd rather have one Swiss Inn (near Magic) than a whole town full of the fake no-soul bullshit at any of SnoLoco's recommendations.

Here's JamesDeluxe's magazine article on the eastern townships: http://nyskiblog.com/magazine/#nabble-td1464959

Certainly off the beaten path but undeniably interesting.

snoloco wrote

When Gore is fully open, it will spread the crowds out better than the rest will.  During Christmas, don't expect anything more than the front side, topridge, and straightbrook to be open.  The gondola had a 20-30 minute wait when I went in 12-13 and the mountain was fully open then.  If it is half open, I cannot imagine the chaos.  

Sno, from what I can remember, the Christmas week of 12-13 when you were there had two back-to-back mega storms, which drew way more crowds than normal.  Gore gets a lot of day traffic, so a lot of the crowds are weather dependent as well.  I remember skiing there the Friday before New Years that year, and being astounded at the crowds - Crowds I had never seen before, and haven't seen since, and I've been a passholder there for 7 years.  On a "normal" Christmas week, even when the mountain is only 1/2 open, or I should proabably say especially when the mountain is only 1/2 open,  the crowds just aren't there.

marznc wrote

I figure that with AEII installed at Gore, lift lines at the base won't be as bad as recent years during the holidays.  Gore is listed as 445 skiable acres.  But the downside to a bigger mountain for relative novices is that they may get frustrated trying to find their way around when they only have a day or two.  My friends have only been skiing at ski areas under 100 acres.  No need to look at a trail map when a place is that small.

Despite one poster's emphatic opinion, even on the most crowded days there were minimal lines. At worst, there might be a 10-15 minute line on the gondola at around 10am-11am and right after lunch. If the high speed quad (was a high speed triple) is running the line for the HSQ will be nonexistant. There were never lines when it was a HS triple unless the gondola was not running. The rest of Gore's lifts are generally ski right on. There are days (holiday after a snowstorm in flatlandia) when they are turning people away because there is no parking left and the mountain is not crowded.

Your friends will love Gore.

west mt and willard could be an option plenty of lodging in glens falls ,lake george  1 hr from albany . would fit ability levels. west offers shift skiing -4 hrs from the time you buy your ticket.