Exaggerated Snowfall Totals. Cool or Uncool?

Without mention of any names, several mountains do it. It's really been bothering me lately, and I think it has the potential to turn people away.

What are your thoughts?

My experience with snow reporting is primarily with Gore.  As I've said they don't exaggerate, but do make it hard to understand what is actually going on. For example the Gore report shows

Snow Last 24 Hours: 1 inch

Now I KNOW that Emily added one inch to the yesterdays total at the end of the day.  Did it snow today, or is that a holdover?  She gives a 7 day total too (23 inches) so if my numbers match with her's I could theoretically figure it out.

I really like the way Jay Peak handles reporting.  The report has a time stamp (Updated 6:40 am or whatever) and is very clear.  I have no idea if they exaggerate. I skied at Jay one time when it snowed. They called it 5, looked more like 8 to me. Even Steve W said at dinner that night that he felt it was lowballed.

snowfall totals are my pet peeve..the only way to get a accurate amount is use a snow measuring board, that is cleaned off at a specific time daily...

Sticking a ruler in it doesn't count, half the time they end up measuring some of the existing snow pack...

And when someone say's it looks like .....it's usually 30% less

I agree Jason. I think if you are going to use snowfall totals as a marketing tactic, you need to have an accurate way of measuring it.

I think I like the way Jay Peak does it too. I think it's better to lowball it IMO.  I would personally rather be told that X mountain got 5 inches, and then end up finding 8. I think it makes you feel like you're getting something extra special. Now, If I was told that the mountain got 8" and I got there to find only 5", I would be disappointed in the mountain's false marketing.

I think employees see thru the bull crap marketing puts out easier than the public

When I worked at Killington back in the 90's before the Internet you called the snow phone which we called the Killington Lie line to get conditions updates

WF is good about snowfall amounts in my view but the snow quality posted is seriously iffy at times.  On MLK weekend Chevy day marketing claimed primary serface was powder and secondary packed powder when actual conditions varied between hard pack and bullet proof.  The staff was all getting a chuckle out if that.

On the flip side I was down in Philly for work a few weeks ago and WF has some electronic bill boards along the roads that were boasting that WF had received 65" of snow for the winter when the actual at that point was 150".  Marketing paid for signs and forgot to tell the vendor to update them.  They were electronic so changing it should have been super easy.  If that happened in the corporate world that marketing person would be updating their resume.

I don't believe than many on this forum make their decisions based on marketing. The morning snow report has no effect on my plans.  By the time they are posted I'm on my way or at the hill.  At Gore I'm skiing the summit by the time reports are posted.  I look at forecasts, and radar and have a pretty good idea of what I am getting into.  If I was local I wouldn't need them either. I'd look out the window and account for elevation.

Marketing is marketing. When watching TV do you flip out when commercials do what they do? Do you buy Rogaine expecting to score a full head of hair?  Have you bought gold because somebody TV told you it was a good investment?

If you really want accurate snow reporting it can't be a function of marketing. Stowe has independent snow reporting. Then again they get 320 inches of snow, so there is that.

WF doesn't report what trail status is well either.  I sometimes think PR literally looks out the window of their office and then makes the report without going to patrol or snowtribe for real time info.  On Sunday, Lookout was on hold for grooming until about 11:30, but it wasn't on the report, nor posted anywhere on the mountain.  It was really a wise move IMO to do what they did, as it meant that Hoyt's could open, but was frustrating not knowing what was going on until after the fact.

The actual snow totals aren't the deciding factor for me. I too make my decisions based on the forecasts, and sometimes I just take whatever I have time for.

Harvey wrote

 When watching TV do you flip out when commercials do what they do?

Yes.

Automobile commercials are my biggest pet peeve. I'm good with promoting the hell out of stuff and creating a good perception, but making cars do things they were never meant to do or are physically able to do is ridiculous. Then again, I know zip about marketing. It does get your attention I guess.

Not all marketing is that way tho.

Do you guys really still listen to resorts' snow forecasts?  In this day and age, with internet weather forecasts, I use pinpoint forecasts for ski areas from various weather sites and gather my own data and then will consult the ski areas to see what they have to say and compare.  IMHO, it offers much better, independent 3rd party info and data.

My dad had an old story from Stowe, back in the day of the single chair and wool blankets...He waits on line to buy a lift ticket and after making the purchase, he turns the corner to head to the lodge and lifts. Right when he turns the corner around the ticket booth, there is a sign that reads: "Conditions: Icy. No Refunds".

JasonWx wrote

And when someone say's it looks like .....it's usually 30% less

AMEN!  And the longer the day goes along, the more snow seems to have fallen the night before.  Yakking in the gondola in the morning it's 4".  By lunch it's 6" and quenching thirst at the end of the day it was 8" with one or two face shots.

Resort totals are an idea of what's fallen.  Wide ass trails will have next to nothing, esp. in the middle.  Narrow trails, or those on the leeward side, will have more.

I bet some measure with a telescoping pole.

If exaggerated snowfall totals bother you then you have too much time on your hands.

Just because it's on the iNtRAwEBz doesn't make it true.

Coach nailed it. There used to be a time when you simply had to go skiing to find out.

I think millenials' collective neediness has caused most mountains to get better at this. Coach mentioned the Killington snow phone earlier. He reminded me of a relevant memory from back then (97/98 I think). I remember them having a clear plastic tube with the inches marked on the outside in marker. Somebody from snowmaking was supposed to empty it every day but I have no idea who did it. I worked in the snowmaking control room overnight and I remember the guy who did the snow phone showing up around 5:30 or 6. Some times he would come in and ask me if it had been emptied cause there was too much in it. I never knew. Other times it got knocked over and he had to guess; or one of the guys was working nearby and tossed it out of the way and he had to guess. Occasionally it snowed so much we lost it under the snow so we had to dig it out and he would guess. So the upshot is is a lot of the time back then it was a WAG. Probably still is at the smaller mountains. We're not talking about IBM here after all.

campgottagopee wrote

If exaggerated snowfall totals bother you then you have too much time on your hands.

Just because it's on the iNtRAwEBz doesn't make it true.

Coach nailed it. There used to be a time when you simply had to go skiing to find out.

It does bother me, but I fail to see how that means I have too much tome on my hands. I think some mountains just think it's ok to call 8" a "foot" assuming that most people won't actually notice. I just don't like being lied to, that's all this is about. It's not really going to change where and when I ski.

Harvey wrote

If you really want accurate snow reporting it can't be a function of marketing.

Nailed it! Exactly!

At Hunter, and many other mountains, snow reporting is a function of the ski patrol.

People have been lying about inches forever... just sayin

Doesn't bother me at all.  I think the reporting is generally fair.  I've had reported two inch days that have skied quite deep (usually out west, if you know where to follow the wind), and I've had one foot days where I'm feeling the old snow surface on every turn...it's all new snow, and it's all fun.

Just makes me thing of an old Caddyshack clip:



I really do miss the old snow report hotlines...get up at 6, call the snow report hotline...those were the days.

pro2860 wrote

People have been lying about inches forever... just sayin

  

snoloco wrote

WF doesn't report what trail status is well either.

Agreed.  A lot lately they have trails listed as open on the report that have ropes across.  Yes, in some instances there may be a lower entrance to a portion of the trail, but not always.  Hey, at least I can always tell the heat "it was listed as open" if I get pulled over!

JTG4eva! wrote

snoloco wrote

WF doesn't report what trail status is well either.

Agreed.  A lot lately they have trails listed as open on the report that have ropes across.  Yes, in some instances there may be a lower entrance to a portion of the trail, but not always.  Hey, at least I can always tell the heat "it was listed as open" if I get pulled over!

Do you think maybe for simplicity they list a trail as open because it will at some point open that day? I doubt they will want to list open trails as of opening then update the conditions report every time a rope drops.

I vote for cool