Holiday Valley, NY - 12/3/13

Drove down to HV Monday night after work. Skied from 7 to 8PM. Conditions were quite good. Real packed powder. The kind that allows you to easily plant your pole on the snow. Left at 8PM to get ready for dinner in the Ellicottville Brewing Company (EBC). If you haven't tried their beers, give them a go if you find them. Quite good. The E'Vil Hoppy winter seasonal is solid.

Drinks at the village for a couple of more hours. Incredible how you can find nice spots to have fun in Ellicottville on a late Monday night in early December. My view that Ellicottville is the third best ski town in the East (Lake Placid and Stowe being 1 & 2) was confirmed. While small, the Eville oozes character. Nice restaurants and shops. Solid.

Back to skiing. Skied Tuesday for a couple of hours. Conditions not as good as the night before. Frozen corduroy I would call them. Seems like they groomed and it froze after they did so. No one on the hill. Midweek early season skiing is fantastic. You have the whole mountain to yourself. As far as the mountain itself, I once again leave with the impression that it skis much bigger than what it is, especially if you focus on the meager 700' vertical drop. The reason why it skis big is it's got a lot of what I call "horizontal" in spite of the lack of vertical.

Horizontally big mountains are those that are spread out over a large area, usually over many peaks. A good example is comparing Whiteface with Gore. Whiteface has the vertical chops, but it's horizontally challenged. So it skis smaller than it should, because many runs seem to funnel down to the same place. In contrast, Gore skis very big in spite of the lack of continuous vertical that can challenge Whiteface. It does so because it has a bunch of distinct areas with their own dedicated lifts. This makes you feel like you don't have to ski by the same place twice during a day.

Back to Holiday Valley. The sense that the mountain is decently sized is backed up by skiable acres stats, which I looked up after getting back from my trip. Perhaps surprisingly, Holiday Valley is the second biggest mountain in NY by skiable acres, behind Gore. Gore has 438 skiable acres, Holiday Valley has 290, Whiteface 283 and Windham 278. So, much to my surprise, HV actually has stats to back it up as a decently sized area.

It is also of note that Holiday Valley has a really good infrastructure. Lodges are phenomenal...probably the best in NY. Lifts are good, fast and efficient. It has the feel of a very high end ski area. Two slopeside hotels, three lodges. Feels very upscale. This might be a plus or a minus, depending on how you look at it. To me it's a plus, especially since its lift ticket prices are very affordable. So, unlike other upscale ski areas, they don't gouge their customers.

Skiing on Tuesday was good, if not spectacular. Coverage was very good for early december. 17 trails and 5 lifts spread out over different mountain areas. HV is not steep at all. Blacks ski like decent blues at challenging resorts such as Whiteface. But still fun. My favorite was Mardi Gras, a nice blue cruiser right under the main Mardi Gras express lift. Skiing down the trail, I felt like it was much longer than the 700' vertical suggests. The person who designed the trail system in HV deserves a prize. Incredible how he did so much with so little.

Some pictures follow.

Nice. Solid report. If Holiday Valley was 1,000 feet taller, it'd be among the best in the east (and if ifs and buts were candies and nuts, it'd be Christmas every day). Ellicottville is such a nice town. Pics of that next time.

WNY-ADK Skier wrote

 
Horizontally big mountains are those that are spread out over a large area, usually over many peaks. A good example is comparing WHiteface with Gore. Whiteface has the vertical chops, but it's horizontally challenged. So it skis smaller than it should, because many runs seem to funnel down to the same place. In contrast, Gore skis very big in spite of the lack of continuous vertical that can challenge Whiteface.  

oh no ,take cover. battle royale ensuing

freeheeln wrote

WNY-ADK Skier wrote

 

Horizontally big mountains are those that are spread out over a large area, usually over many peaks. A good example is comparing WHiteface with Gore. Whiteface has the vertical chops, but it's horizontally challenged. So it skis smaller than it should, because many runs seem to funnel down to the same place. In contrast, Gore skis very big in spite of the lack of continuous vertical that can challenge Whiteface.  

oh no ,take cover. battle royale ensuing

Hehehe ! Good one FH.

Yea, them's fightin words 'round here ! Hehehe.

Might be Ok this time tho. Everybody's too busy pee-ing on each other over in that other thread. Saddle up and ride on over....It's the Wild West

To WNY-ADK, FWIW in the past there's usually a big Brewhaha when Face is compared to Gore. There's even an Old Indian saying about it....." Many panites get in knot."

I certainly know of HV but actually knew nothing about it.  Great overview. Check another ski area off the hit list.

While there seems to be significant crossover between Central and Eastern NY skiers, you seem like a bit of an anomaly - a western NY skier who comes east and into VT(?).

Some of us were at the SANY (ski areas of ny) event last night in nyc, and I always go to that gig hoping to meet someone from Peek n Peak or HV or Holimont or Bristol, but no western ny areas are members.  Would love to see some cross pollination.

One thing about skiable acres - everyone measures it differently. I think Mad River basically says that every inch of the property is skiable. Other areas estimate trail acreage, and some do something in between.

Thanks for the report.

mattchuck2 wrote

Nice. Solid report. If Holiday Valley was 1,000 feet taller, it'd be among the best in the east (and if ifs and buts were candies and nuts, it'd be Christmas every day). Ellicottville is such a nice town. Pics of that next time.

Thanks for the kind words about the report. I agree that if HV were 1,000 feet taller it’d be amongst the best in the east. Given that it’s not, it’s a solid choice, but not worth a drive from places that are closer to the ADK’s, VT, NH or Maine. However, if you ever lose something that requires you to come close to Western NY, it’s definitely worth a visit. And Ellicottville is definitely worth a visit if you’re ever around, even in the off-season. I’ll post pics of the village next time.

Snowballs wrote

freeheeln wrote

WNY-ADK Skier wrote

 

Horizontally big mountains are those that are spread out over a large area, usually over many peaks. A good example is comparing WHiteface with Gore. Whiteface has the vertical chops, but it's horizontally challenged. So it skis smaller than it should, because many runs seem to funnel down to the same place. In contrast, Gore skis very big in spite of the lack of continuous vertical that can challenge Whiteface.  

oh no ,take cover. battle royale ensuing

Hehehe ! Good one FH.

Yea, them's fightin words 'round here ! Hehehe.

Might be Ok this time tho. Everybody's too busy pee-ing on each other over in that other thread. Saddle up and ride on over....It's the Wild West

To WNY-ADK, FWIW in the past there's usually a big Brewhaha when Face is compared to Gore. There's even an Old Indian saying about it....." Many panites get in knot."

I wasn’t aware of the whole Whiteface vs. Gore battle royale going on here. I didn’t want to stir the pot. As I mentioned in a different thread, I’m actually spending a month in Lake Placid this winter, so I didn’t mean to diss the face when I said it’s horizontally challenged. It’s a truly rugged mountain and as challenging as any other hill in the East. But Gore has its allure as well. It’s not vertically exciting like Whiteface, but horizontally amazing. Great trees and nice lift system. Underrated. But what WF has is Lake Placid and the history. That’s difficult to beat. Both are phenomenal ski areas that compare favorably with most more popular Vermont resorts.

Harvey wrote

I certainly know of HV but actually knew nothing about it.  Great overview. Check another ski area of the hit list.

While there seems to be significant crossover between Central and Eastern NY skiers, you seem like a bit of an anomaly - a western NY skier who comes east and into VT(?).

Some of us were at the SANY (ski areas of ny) event last night in nyc, and I always go to that gig hoping to meet someone from Peek n Peak or HV or Holimont or Bristol, but no western ny areas are members.  Would love to see some cross pollination.

One thing about skiable acres - everyone measures it differently. I think Mad River basically says that every inch of the property is skiable. Other areas estimate trail acreage, and some do something in between.

Thanks for the report.

Thanks for the kind words re the trip report as well, Harv. I guess you’re right that I’m an anomaly. I used to live in the NYC area, so I skied southern and central VT quite often. I day tripped the Catskills and did several multi day trips to the ADK’s (Whiteface and Gore). I’m an explorer, never settling for a single area or state, so the move to WNY hasn’t dampened my interest in venturing elsewhere. Initially I thought that it was a bad move skiing wise to be in this part of the state. But now that I got a feel for what it’s like to be an hour away from HV, I’m kind of digging it. Five hours to Gore, six to Lake Placid and six to Killington are all long drives, but I used to do 4:30 every week to central Vermont from NYC area, so I can take it. And now that I’m staying a month in Lake Placid, I’m very much looking forward. Also really digging my SANY Gold Pass. I’m for sure an anomaly. Hopefully I meet more anomalies here!!

Also, we should do NY Ski Blog annual ski meetings in different ski resorts. Perhaps one in the Catskills, one in the ADK’s, one in Central NY and one in Western NY. We can all try to attend as many as we can, with perhaps a principal one in the ADK’s as the sort of official one, with the other ones being the regional meetings. I volunteer to coordinate the WNY one. Also willing to attend the CNY and ADK one. Thoughts?

WNY-ADK Skier,

Would said NYSKIBLOG get-togethers involve Skiing, B-BQ'ng (Venison, of course) and local craft brews?  If so, I'm in with a whole gaggle of More Gore Trash in tow.  What's the worst that could happen?  BTW, since you'll probably need a break from WF's numbing steeps during your month in North Elba and the ORDA nerve center, slide down to The 'Crick and take a Tour da' Trees that's sure to please.  Just sayin'.

Ski you later.

64ER wrote

WNY-ADK Skier,

Would said NYSKIBLOG get-togethers involve Skiing, B-BQ'ng (Venison, of course) and local craft brews?  If so, I'm in with a whole gaggle of More Gore Trash in tow.  What's the worst that could happen?  BTW, since you'll probably need a break from WF's numbing steeps during your month in North Elba and the ORDA nerve center, slide down to The 'Crick and take a Tour da' Trees that's sure to please.  Just sayin'.

Ski you later.

Hey 64ER, the NYSKIBLOG get-togethers would most definitely involve grilling an local craft brews. Glad to know that you're in. Let's make this happen. Are you in just for the ADK one or will you also travel for a Catskill, CNY or WNY one?

Harv...thoughts on this idea?

Finally....I'll definitely hit Gore several times while I'm living in Lake Placid. Will you give me said tour of the trees? If so, I'm in! Brews in hand as a token of my appreciation.

Another option might be when/if Powderqueen rents that farm house near Gore for a big get together. Sometimes she has unfilled beds and offers them on here.

Just a thought.

Nice idea you have WNY.

I'm wondering what you would recommend for a day trip from Toronto. Holiday Valley or Bristol Mountain. I'm looking for a little more than Ontario has to offer and I've never skied NY before.

Dear Gasman'

Either is a lonnnnng day trip, can you make it a long weekend?  If so, either resort will welcome you; that's what they do.  Have you considered the Adirondack Options?  

Ski you on the hill.

gasman wrote

I'm wondering what you would recommend for a day trip from Toronto. Holiday Valley or Bristol Mountain. I'm looking for a little more than Ontario has to offer and I've never skied NY before.

Hey Gasman... I posted a Bristol trip report several days ago in which I compare both mountain. You might find it helpful. I prefer Holiday Valley because it has more terrain (skiable acres), some of the best facilities in the East and a picturesque village that oozes character (Ellicottville). However, I enjoyed Bristol very much. If more vertical is your priority, then you should definitely do Bristol. For a day trip it's a close call. For an overnighter, Holiday Valley wins because of Ellicottville. But, as was mentioned here, if you want to pull an overnighter, consider the Adirondacks, which offer skiing at a much higher level.

Enjoy your trip!!