ORDA Ordered to Enact Contract

http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/ORDA-ordered-to-enact-pact-4644088.php?t=9dcfe786eb

It's about time!!!

"In 2007, DEC said full-time, year-round workers at the Belleayre ski center would be reassigned as seasonal employees. "After laying us off they brought us back as part timers," said Donald Bush, a mechanic at the resort.

"That meant for a big portion of the year you were not getting paid," CSEA spokesman Steve Madarasz said."


Well, duh.

What, they actually expect to get paid year round? Wait, wait, and then there's the pension, too, right? Lift ops with pensions. No wonder the other private operators nearby are pissed off. Who would you work for, the state or the private enterprise?

CONTENTS DELETED

I don't support the concept of unions, but I do believe in fair dealing. So...if the ORDA employees choose to be unionized (a bad move overall, but their right) then ORDA must deal with them fairly.

CONTENTS DELETED

What the problem with getting paid a full year and only having work for 1/2?      After considering the union boss in NJ who "worked" 2 hours day, and slept that away, while getting his full pay.       At least the mechanic is working 1/2 yr.    


It does bother me to know that the resorts have to hire forign labor to run lifts.    Sad, actually.    I wonder if the resorts would proactively adverstise these positions if more US tweens would do it.     Had I known if I could work as a liftie a few nights or weekends a week and get some free skiing and paid, I would have jumped at it when I was in college.     Did not know.    I bet I know 3-4 tweens today who would work at Kmart for a place to stay, a job and a day of skiing for the winter.   The only problem is that I dont think those employees get the free day up there, or at our mountain.    We also have to bring in labor and house them, but I think they work 7 days a week.    

Knowing what I know about most American kids who are and were employed at Killington, on and off the mountain, I wouldn't hire them. Basically, and this may sound harsh, but, a bunch of budding alcoholics with a drug problem (their problem is that they can't afford them) and bad attitudes.

CONTENTS DELETED

Yep. I go with parents not teaching work ethic and giving kids too much.   Why would a kid work to eat and pay rent and be left with a bit of spending money, when mom and dad let him live in the basement till 28 , feed, cloth, give him the beemer keys and some cash.  He only needs to work to buy pot and beer.   Sterrotyping for sure, there are some really good kids with strong work ethic ( my 22 yr old niece has 3 jobs and is in nursing school) butnot enough of them to fill the void.    Don't get me wrong, employers and government policy is just as much to blame.  

Vermont ski areas, and, well, most ski areas, don't attract the "good" kids. They attract the kids who want to party, basically. I have found that Killington is full of kids from places like, oh, Ballston Spa, NY, and Springfield, Mass., to name a few, where NOTHING is goin' on, so they gravitate to the funnest place for miles. Priority #1 seems to be drinking, #2 is playing in the snow (although, seriously, I witnessed a few kids in a house I shared sleep through many a powder morning), and a distant #3 is customer service. Sorry for the stereotyping, but, I have been appalled at times at the attitudes of ski bum lifer employees, both in the East and West. Utah is much better, though. Those blond Mormon kids are brought up to be polite to their elders, and, chances are, have never experienced a hangover or coffee jitters that would wipe that smile off their face.

Man, you people are coming off as a bunch of old A-holes with "get off my lawn" attitudes towards kids who are just trying to have a job that they enjoy. If you think they have it so great, maybe you should try doing the job for a while.

Try working the night shift on a snowmaking crew, or picking up trash for $8.00 an hour or so, or looking after 10-12 kids for 2 hours - trying to keep them safe in a wild crowded environment, keeping them entertained, trying to teach them something new - all while making less than a babysitter would make for sitting on a couch.

The reason they import workers is because they don't want to pay actual wages. They can import people, pay them like crap, and keep them under their thumbs because if they ever screw up, they're faced with the loss of both their job and their living situation. If they had a worker from Ballston Spa (which I'm surprised to learn is a hellhole with nothing to do), he could just leave when he was mistreated and get a better job (like working at Target - yes, I made more money when I worked at Target).

It's amazing the arrogance and "I'm better than you" attitude that some people on here have towards young people. These are kids that work their asses off on a mostly thankless job, for very little pay, simply because they love skiing and they want to pass their love on to other people. And all you have to say is that they have bad attitudes and poor customer service. Well, guess what? Walmart has horrible customer service, too. But if you go to a place that pays a decent wage (Costco, Wegman's, etc.), you actually find a lot of employees that are friendly and totally willing to go the extra mile for you.

I'm lucky I don't have to rely on the income from a Ski Area to survive, and most of you don't either. I agree that it's stupid to pay people all year to do a seasonal job, but let's not act like ski resort employees are rolling in money.

(Cue a bunch of a-holes saying, "if you don't like it, quit")

CONTENTS DELETED

DackerDan wrote

I don't think anyone said that ski resort employees are rolling in  money.

You said that ORDA treats employees "almost too fair", whatever that means.

And you also endorsed hiring low cost foreign labor because they are "happy to be here" and have "a good attitude".

Then you said that employees at ORDA should be happy that they use local labor.

Listen, I'm a fan of immigration, and I'm not a crazy jingoistic tea-party type, but to say that people should "be happy" that a state authority hires people that are actually from the state is freaking crazy. I'm sure they could hire an all foreign ski patrol if they wanted to. Would you enjoy that?  

mattchuck2 wrote

 I'm sure they could hire an all foreign ski patrol if they wanted to. Would you enjoy that?

Isn't it already like a 50/50 split between Bolshevik Trotsky-ites and former members of Saddam's "Elite Republican Guard?"

CONTENTS DELETED

No body is getting rich in the east off skiing.  We do what we do because we love the sport and we have our own various ways to pay it forward.

CONTENTS DELETED

Almost every resort employee I dealt with this year was super nice, give them all a raise.

DackerDan wrote

I suppose you feel that they should import labor, with an attitude like that I guess you would prefer they fill ski school with all foreign labor. I certainly don't advocate that and would not wish that on you.

Other than a pass I get no compensation from ORDA and I give them many more free days than they ask for. I also give a lot of time training others so they to can volunteer And help those who need it. Unlike snow sports, many of us are unpaid.

If you think I "feel that they should import labor", you are reading this conversation completely wrong (and I can't tell if you're doing it on purpose to be a dick). YOU'RE the one saying how happy foreigners are when they're working at American resorts. I was the one saying it's a crock of shit because these resorts are able to keep these employees under their thumb for a variety of reasons.

And as far as "no compensation", you can't list a $75 day pass or $600 season pass as not part of the compensation package. That's one of the ways that they are allowed to get away with not paying you to do labor! I.e. you wouldn't do that stuff if you had to pay for a pass (and if you would, apparently ORDA really is treating you well, because they could CHARGE you money and you'd STILL work for them). Also, FYI, some instructors work "unpaid" as well...

Mountain employees should be paid more. ALL mountain employees. I don't know what you do all day that makes you feel like you're overappreciated and overcompensated, but when I'm at the mountain working, I'm working pretty damn hard. It'd be nice to see some support coming from you, and not just a bunch of statements saying that people who work for Ski Areas should be happy to have jobs and they should just take whatever scraps they get.