Specifically, What is it you'd like to change?

normal retirement age 66.  Start working at 20.  Ave salary 50k put away 5,500. for 46 years @ 5% will produce 5500 per month guaranteed for the remainder of the his life.

I think of your idea like this.  There is a farmer with a chicken coup.  He has a fox that keeps going in and taking his chickens.  He is figuring out how he is going to solve the problem.  his solution buy more chickens.

hahahahah!  buy more chickens!!  hahahahahahha!!  

good one!

tjf1967 wrote

normal retirement age 66.  Start working at 20.  Ave salary 50k put away 5,500. for 46 years @ 5% will produce 5500 per month guaranteed for the remainder of the his life.

I think of your idea like this.  There is a farmer with a chicken coup.  He has a fox that keeps going in and taking his chickens.  He is figuring out how he is going to solve the problem.  his solution buy more chickens.

I know how to save money. I'm well aware that I can save enough money outside if the social security system myself. I'm saving a lot more than $5,500 a year.

I'm telling you that there are other people in this country that don't save. Read this to be scared:
http://time.com/money/4266111/retirement-crisis-worse-average-americans/

Not enough people saving and a lot of people thinking they'll just work their whole life. Not entirely realistic in their plans, but weird to classify them as foxes who are trying to steal other people's chickens.

The better analogy is that some squirrels are good at saving nuts and some aren't. In the animal kingdom, the squirrels that aren't good savers will just die. That's what some people in the Republican party would prefer we do to people:

http://youtu.be/irx_QXsJiao

I think if we just reallocate our nut distribution better, we can help everyone. Here, tjf, you can start with Deez Nuts.

I'm an example of someone with nothing. Like zilch. My bank account just went negative yesterday in fact and I'm 40 years old.

I have never had a job that lets me save much if anything at all. I live check to check or student loan disbursement to student loan disbursement.

When I worked at Pink Jeep Tours I made a little better money and I was almost out of debt and then I had to take Momma to court to make sure I had regular access to our daughter. That set me back 20k and my credit cards were loaded again. I didn't have any choice though, her life is more important than mine now, that's why I'm also back in school trying to get a real job. I figure if I can pay of my debt in a year or a year and a half and then live really simple and not much different than I do now I should be able to use around half of my income to put away and save. Helicopter skiing in AK could ruin me though. :)

I think a big problem for a lot of people is that they live well beyond their means in an effort to keep up with the Jones's. I have never understood that mentality and it was rampant in NJ when I was growing up, it was a big part of why I ran from that place as soon as I could.

The second part of this thread comes when we look at Which candidates are likelier to make the changes we want to see.

I'd say Bernie is likeliest to please most of us, and he supports my Social Security plan (with a donut hole from $118,500 to $250,000):

https://berniesanders.com/issues/strengthen-and-expand-social-security/

And if Bernie doesn't make it? Besides the Border issue, which I'm highly skeptical that Trump will be able to do anything about, the Trade issue, and the SuperPAC issue, I'd say Hillary Clinton is more likely to do the fixes that people want. Trump ain't raising the minimum wage and he ain't doing anything to help people find jobs (even if he does push his white nationalist agenda through)

whoa whoa whoa!  you're taking credit for Bernie plan bro?!?!  WTF!

And Trump is gonna bring his tie factory back from china along with the china children to America and make American Great Again!!!  

Harv can we have a ButtTrumpet icon please?

ScottyJack wrote

whoa whoa whoa!  you're taking credit for Bernie plan bro?!?!  WTF!

Haha, okay, fine. I agree with Bernie's plan (except for that donut hole). Screw you, rich downstaters and Jersians!

Please HARV ...we NEEEEEED a Butt Trumpet emoji,  oh man it would be awesome !!! It would make us all feel GREAT again 🤓😟

Want BUTT TRUMPET emoji !!!!

My example was what someone has contributed to the SS system. They are not going to get even half of what they would at 5%, which we all know is very low for that time frame.

tjf1967 wrote

My example was what someone has contributed to the SS system. They are not going to get even half of what they would at 5%, which we all know is very low for that time frame.

Yeah, we all know that we can make more money ourselves than we can from the social security system. But, as I said, social security is a vital part of the retirement of most of the people in this country. People don't save, so a super conservative old person national pension program is needed (just about every developed country has one).

Would you prefer to go back to the days before social security when old people just died in poverty? Provocative idea, but I think I'd rather keep the system as is.

Of course not but I don't want to add more money to it.  Why add more chickens until you figure out how to keep the fox out? Get it now?

I can see how private account could be beneficial to most.  The systems suckers would be out of luck but we can get Mexico to take care of them.  This country is wrought with fraud in just about every aspect of government.  It comes out everyday.  I am not for putting more money into system until it is cleared up.  It wont get cleaned  up until people start going to jail.   A black kid sells some weed on the side of the road and goes to jail for 5 years.  Other people steal billions, flop economies and get golden parachutes.  

We need to take care of the suckers at the bottom and the top.

How is it my problem if people had the ability to save for retirement but didn't?  Why should I have to pay for them?  People that truly are in poverty without the means to save for retirement is different we cant just not take care of them.

Forced savings into a IRA is a solution.  If you are not saving at least 5% and better 10% of earnings for retirement into a 401K 403B or IRA the tax code could penalize you into doing so.  It would be like the tax on not having Obamacare.

This would put the emphasis on having to provide for your own retirement as it should be and not looking for the handout.

That account needs to be private so that Congress can not raid the cookie jar.

I am sure one thing people and Virginia and Oregon would like to change is Obamacare. I just read today that the 2017 Obamacare insurance rates will be going up around 15% in Virginia and close to 30% in Oregon, other states will follow soon! I but your favorite candidate will now get a big boost from this.

PeeTex wrote

I am sure one thing people and Virginia and Oregon would like to change is Obamacare. I just read today that the 2017 Obamacare insurance rates will be going up around 15% in Virginia and close to 30% in Oregon, other states will follow soon! I but your favorite candidate will now get a big boost from this.

No, you read that Insurance companies REQUESTED rate increases of 15% to 30%. They'll never get it. Nobody knows what the actual rate increase will be because those numbers haven't come out yet.

Stop trying to confuse people.

mattchuck2 wrote

PeeTex wrote

I am sure one thing people and Virginia and Oregon would like to change is Obamacare. I just read today that the 2017 Obamacare insurance rates will be going up around 15% in Virginia and close to 30% in Oregon, other states will follow soon! I but your favorite candidate will now get a big boost from this.

No, you read that Insurance companies REQUESTED rate increases of 15% to 30%. They'll never get it. Nobody knows what the actual rate increase will be because those numbers haven't come out yet.

Stop trying to confuse people.

Yes, I spoke too strongly - these are requested rate hikes. But - if the insurance companies don'tget what they ask for they could always exit those states, they - unlike us, are not forced to participate and regulators will take this into account. Even if they get just half, that's a Yooge increase (Ya like that Harv). What I also read was that the final rates will be out a few weeks before election time - bye bye Hillary...

Why are drugs so much cheaper in Canada than in the US?

Harvey wrote

Why are drugs so much cheaper in Canada than in the US?

Because big Pharma owns our politicians, Just ask Hillary. http://www.cnn.com/2016/02/11/health/big-pharma-presidential-politics/

If you want to solve this - you know who to vote for - look where the money is NOT going.

So you don't think single payer has anything to do with it?

PeeTex wrote

Yes, I spoke too strongly - these are requested rate hikes. But - if the insurance companies don'tget what they ask for they could always exit those states, they - unlike us, are not forced to participate and regulators will take this into account. Even if they get just half, that's a Yooge increase (Ya like that Harv). What I also read was that the final rates will be out a few weeks before election time - bye bye Hillary...

You're assuming that people pay a lot of attention to the news.

You're also assuming that the 12.5 million people who purchase health care on the exchanges weild an awful lot of voting power, when you know that most voters (and most people) get insurance from their employers or from Medicare.

You're also ignoring Clinton's recent reintroduction of the public option, allowing people to buy into Medicare (which would have been in the original bill if Joe fucking Lieberman wasn't in the pocket of health insurance companies when they were discussing this in 2009).

But sure, it might have some non-zero effect on the election.