Whiteface Conditions (2011-2012)

ausable skier wrote

Guys

This is not just about me whining about not being able to ski.  Orda as part of its mission has an economic impact on the surrounding area.  By not stock piling snow on key trails WF is forcing the cancelation  of probably at least a thousand hotels reservations in the area for the next 3 weeks.  Resturants that were counting on skier revenue to make it thru mud season are now facing a month longer mud season.  How many businesses might go under because of this?

Nysef had a race scheduled for this weekend that had over 200 kids signed up for it. They had to return over $20 grand in race entry fees.  As a non profit how do you make up for a 20k hole in your budget that suddenly appears.  Those 200 racers and their families would have spent at least $100 grand this weekend in LP and the area.

There was a school group from England coming to LP to ski in a few weeks.  We could be talking about millions of dollars of lost revenue for local businesses and the resulting tax dollars to the county and towns.

You think that the local business owners wouldn't trade that for having the Wilmington Trail not open this season - in a second they would.

Jesus.

There's no argument that the economic impact here is staggering, however, if you think that by simply not blowing snow on Lookout Mountain, that would have made everything A-Ok, you're kidding yourself.

The weather has been a nightmare for the past 2 weeks, and according to the current forecast, with the exception of Monday and Tuesday upcoming, it will continue to be a nightmare through this weekend, and then again starting on Wednesday of next week.

But taking this one step further ... Ok, you're the manager ... what trail(s) would you have added snow to if you hadn't blown on Lookout Mountain? Skyward? Victoria? Paron's Run? Mountain Run? Upper Thruway? Draper's Drop? Upper Valley? Excelsior? Lower Northway? Lower Valley? Easy Street? Boreen? Even with all the snow that was blown on Lookout, you wouldn't have been able to cover everything, so what should they have done?

By the way, don't lose sight of the fact that all the "runs" taken by skiers on Lookout Mountain would have translated to more runs on the other trails, so there would have been more "snow loss" on those other trails.

Numerous mountains in Vermont will be closing this weekend as well, or have already closed. To simply attribute this problem to "mismanagement" is convenient, but unrealistic. Every ski resort and ski town is hurting. Based on your past posts, you obviously have an issue with Bruce and Whiteface management in general, but realistically, there wasn't much they could do to overcome the weather.

I don't know Bruce, and I have no real opinion of him at all, however, all I can go by is what I've seen over the past 9 seasons skiing at Whiteface regularly, and I think he has done a very good job since he took over. Is everything perfect, no ... absolutely not, but I think things are better than they used to be.

tBatt wrote

ausable skier wrote

Guys

This is not just about me whining about not being able to ski.  Orda as part of its mission has an economic impact on the surrounding area.  By not stock piling snow on key trails WF is forcing the cancelation  of probably at least a thousand hotels reservations in the area for the next 3 weeks.  Resturants that were counting on skier revenue to make it thru mud season are now facing a month longer mud season.  How many businesses might go under because of this?

Nysef had a race scheduled for this weekend that had over 200 kids signed up for it. They had to return over $20 grand in race entry fees.  As a non profit how do you make up for a 20k hole in your budget that suddenly appears.  Those 200 racers and their families would have spent at least $100 grand this weekend in LP and the area.

There was a school group from England coming to LP to ski in a few weeks.  We could be talking about millions of dollars of lost revenue for local businesses and the resulting tax dollars to the county and towns.

You think that the local business owners wouldn't trade that for having the Wilmington Trail not open this season - in a second they would.

Jesus.

I guess that was another way to respond!

It is easy to blame human decision for a season like this but as someone I ran into on the mountain yesterday pointed out at Gore..."In my 28 years here I have never seen a season like this"   If you think back to 2007 at least we had two storms that helped the season last, this year we had nothing.  Blame the 2011-12 season on Mother Nature and move on.  Hind sight is 20-20...no one expected a season like this

Face4Me wrote

To simply attribute this problem to "mismanagement" is convenient, but unrealistic. Based on your past posts, you obviously have an issue with Bruce and Whiteface management in general, but realistically, there wasn't much they could do to overcome the weather.

He's just getting started. In short order, he'll get around to blaming Belleayre for Whiteface's early closure.

ausable skier wrote

Guys

This is not just about me whining about not being able to ski.  Orda as part of its mission has an economic impact on the surrounding area.  By not stock piling snow on key trails WF is forcing the cancelation  of probably at least a thousand hotels reservations in the area for the next 3 weeks.  Resturants that were counting on skier revenue to make it thru mud season are now facing a month longer mud season.  How many businesses might go under because of this?

Nysef had a race scheduled for this weekend that had over 200 kids signed up for it. They had to return over $20 grand in race entry fees.  As a non profit how do you make up for a 20k hole in your budget that suddenly appears.  Those 200 racers and their families would have spent at least $100 grand this weekend in LP and the area.

There was a school group from England coming to LP to ski in a few weeks.  We could be talking about millions of dollars of lost revenue for local businesses and the resulting tax dollars to the county and towns.

You think that the local business owners wouldn't trade that for having the Wilmington Trail not open this season - in a second they would.

 that is absolutely not true.  the mountain has been dead and always is end of season.  a tiny bit more snow on a few trails wouldnt make a difference.  nobody is driving up from NYC or jersey to ski when its 80 degrees down there.  Its season pass holders skiing now.  the group from england i believe is this weekend and they are still coming. now we'll get fishermen, hikers etc instead.  this is about you and your personal interests not the economic benefits of the area.  We probably got more people up here because of the terrain and conditions we offered by opening up w trail anyway, to offset one weekend with a handful of skiers on the hill.  please.

sudsnbumps wrote

 Blame the 2011-12 season on Mother Nature and move on.  Hind sight is 20-20...no one expected a season like this

Mother Nature blames us!  

http://piedmont.patch.com/articles/climate-change-the-end-of-sierra-skiing

Did your drivers license get taken away?  We are not K and don't pretend or want to be.   If you want to ski take a ride across the pond.  Or you could ski bumps all weekend.  Are you a bump guy?  

Dont take this the wrong way but from your posts you think of no one but yourself.  There is nothing wrong with that but don't pretend to care for the sake of trying to prove your point.  Your signature sais it all.  That being said.  i will buy you a beer sat if that will make you feel better.  I think you would be a hoot to talk to.

The earth has been through so many different periods that when it is sick of our era it will act like a wet dog...shake vigorously and start over.  I'm not worried about climate change because really there is nothing we can do about it with other countries like China who don't give a damn.  When it comes to skiing...I am very selfish but don't need to inflict my views on others although AS's rants are entertaining.  The ski season in our area is over...there may be strips here and there and there will still be some hike to patches but let's face it, there's nothing we can do about it and need to move on.  There was definitely money lost with the NYSEF races that were originally scheduled for Gore.  I got a text on Tuesday when I was at Whiteface that they changed the venue to Whiteface...I returned the text saying, don't plan on it.  I really was hoping to run into Ausable on Tuesday but got real selfish and only lapped Skyward all day...alone    I think the thing I missed most this season is not being able to ski the slides...

P.S.  If climate change is responsible for the great year we had last year, I'm all for it

Downloading on the gondola as we speak.  Fun day, all things considered.  Glad my two older kids decided to brave it.  Good news today was, even though there was a little skiing over grass and stream, Excelsior to Upper Valley to Little Whiteface lift was skiable.....no walking required.  Bad news is, in my educated opinion, unless they can find a way to push some serious snow up Upper Valley, it won't be skiable without walking.  

As I was typing, my daughter said she heard the lift attendant on the phone saying something about being closed tomorrow.  Stay tuned......

And as I was changing out of my boots my wife and youngest said they thought the DJ said something about everything but the BagJump being closed tomorrow.  None of this is official, but if you are planning on coming tomorrow watch the website for updates.

Just asked at the ticket counter if there was any word on tomorrow.  She said probably more of the same as today.  So I asked....you think you will be open?  She said yes.

tBatt wrote

Jesus.

too funny  and thank you for saying that                              

tjf1967 wrote

Dont take this the wrong way but from your posts you think of no one but yourself.  There is nothing wrong with that but don't pretend to care for the sake of trying to prove your point.  Your signature sais it all.  That being said.  i will buy you a beer sat if that will make you feel better.  I think you would be a hoot to talk to.

I actually have other plans made weeks ago and can't ski this weekend regardless of the lack of snow so this whole thing was not a selfish rant becuase i wanted to ski.  Everyone reading this wants to ski.
 
The one selfish thing I did do is point out that I was right about not making it to Easter though its a sad thing.  Everyone likes being right but in this case I really wish I wasn't.

It funny that I was said to be a lover of Kmart when my posts clearly have shown I'm not.  They do some things though really well at the big K and making snow and using it strategically is at the top of the list.

I'm very much a buy local kind of guy and am worried about the impact to local business since I'm friends with many folks that own small businesses in the area.  Pants is so wrong about economic impact lacking in the spring.  The loss of the NYSEF race alone will have at least a $100k negative impact to local businesses plus the loss of the $20k to Nysef.  Even having 100 extra guests in local lodging brings for the weekend means $25k at least in economic impact to the area and we lost way more than that for the next 3 weeks.  

In general you guys take me waaaay too seriously.  I treat this forum as if I was sitting in a bar shooting the crap with a group of friends.  Someday I'll have to have a beer and a hoot with the short guy TJF.  To quote TJF and Sargent Hulka - Lighten up Francis.  With that comment Aussie will take off and not grace this forum until next fall.