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Jay, Burke and EB-5

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campgottagopee

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

PeeTex wrote

campgottagopee wrote

Sure beats the illegals in this country leaching on us.

Don't be Harp'n on them peeps, there the ones cleaning Hillarys toilet for $5/hr.

campgottagopee

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

In reply to this post by endoftheline

endoftheline wrote

Personally I think the Feds should bear the brunt of the blame for this, lax oversight for years allowed this to happen.
bigger problem I have is that with all the money being spent, virtually nothing on the hill was improved and I know that is how the system works but it still stinks for the skiers.

It's not about skiing anymore. sad, very sad

warp daddy

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

In reply to this post by riverc0il

SPOT On analysis , RIV !

POlitically , Coach i think just likes to twist tails any chance he gets IMHO , But then again when you put stock in Faux News , its hardly fair and balanced .

Life ain't a dress rehearsal: Spread enthusiasm , avoid negative nuts.

ml242

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

In reply to this post by Thacheronix

Meanwhile this all started under a republican governor, there is plenty of blame to go around for anyone that wants to point fingers.

skimore

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

In reply to this post by riverc0il

riverc0il wrote

The program isn't corrupt,

Sure seems like it is

http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2016/04/buy-a-visa-program-supporters-hope-reform-will-save-steady-flow-of-foreign-investment.html/

“It is widely acknowledged that the EB-5 program is riddled with flaws and corruption,” the Iowa senator said during a February hearing. “Despite the need for reform, the fiscal year 2016 omnibus appropriations bill included a straight and clean extension of the program. This was a disappointment given the alarm bells and whistleblower allegations.”

http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-eb5-investor-fraud-20151204-story.html

http://eb5info.com/articles/1736-who-is-senate-candidate-patrick-murphy-working

http://www.argusleader.com/story/news/2016/04/07/jackley-calls-more-info-conflicts-deflects-criticism-conspiracy-theories/82742686/

http://fortune.com/2014/07/24/immigration-eb-5-visa-for-sale/

A December 2013 study by the Department of Homeland Security’s inspector general found that the government “cannot demonstrate that the program is improving the U.S. economy and creating jobs for U.S. citizens.” A February 2014 paper by the Brookings-Rockefeller Project on State and Metropolitan Innovation concluded that “knowledge of the program’s true economic impact is elusive at best.”

For the first 18 years of its existence, the EB-5 program was a dud. It fell dramatically short of projections that it would foster 40,000 jobs a year and never approached the program’s annual ceiling of 10,000 visas. In 2003 the government issued EB-5 visas to 65 immigrants.

The EB-5 program isn’t overseen by a financial regulator but by the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS), part of the Department of Homeland Security. Accustomed to processing visas and conducting immigrant background checks, USCIS is ill-equipped to review business plans, job- creation studies, and securities offerings. The SEC retains the power to police fraud. What that means is the agency has no mechanism to sniff out a problem until it has exploded, at which point the agency can only clean up the mess.

pro2860

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

In reply to this post by campgottagopee

campgottagopee wrote

PeeTex wrote

campgottagopee wrote

Sure beats the illegals in this country leaching on us.

Don't be Harp'n on them peeps, there the ones cleaning Hillarys toilet for $5/hr.

At least her shit doesn't stink...

tjf1967

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

This post was updated on .

Figured I would chime in. I like the idea of the program. It brought assets and infrastructure to the USA and did not cost me a dime. What happened in Jay is ridiculous, what is just as ridiculous is that no one will go to jail if found guilty. Looks like as long as enough zeros are at the end of the fraud no one goes to jail in this country.

Infrastructure does not go away, when everything is all said and done the region will be further ahead. Not to say it could not have been better but it the US where fuck you neighbor is another amendment to the constitution.

endoftheline

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

tjf1967 wrote

Figured I would chime in. I like the idea of the program. It brought assets and infrastructure to the USA and did not cost me a dime. What happened in Jay is ridiculous, what is just as ridiculous is that no one will go to jail if found guilty. Looks like as long as enough zeros are at the end of the fraud no one goes to jail in this country.

Infrastructure does not go away, when everything is all said and done the region will be further ahead. Not to say it could not have been better but it the US where fuck you neighbor is another amendment to the constitution.

Agree, ridiculous that no one will go to jail, If Martha Stewart went to jail, these guys certainly should.

raisingarizona

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

We have two very different justice systems here in the US.

trackbiker

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Someone will be going to jail. The SEC does not have power over criminal matters. The justice department and likely the State of Vermont will be filing charges once they have reviewed all of the evidence. Fraud is a crime. Just ask Bernie Madoff.

Sick Bird Rider

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

This post was updated on .

Stenger and Q are in big doodoo. What a shell game:

http://vtdigger.org/2016/04/14/quiros-stenger-accused-of-15-state-law-violations-too/

There is a bio piece on Quiros in a 2014 VTDigger article, and it quotes Quiros:

VTDigger wrote

Quiros says that, despite his penchant for trouble, he avoids it in business by not borrowing money.

“If I had a dollar, I lived with a dollar, instead of looking for the easy way, borrowing money,” Quiros says. “That makes an entrepreneur.”

I guess borrowing money from investors in 2008 to pay for the resort they thought they were investing in doesn't count.

Edit: read the comments in the article. This one is mind-blowing:

Jeremy Wheeler wrote

From reading the briefs in both the SEC and VT state filings, it appears that Phase I and II of the jay peak buildout were conceived and sold as EB-5 investments initially by Stenger acting in his role as CEO and general manager for Mt. St. Sauveur Inc (MSSI), the Canadian company which had owned Jay since the 70’s. At some point in this initial project, which until this time was on the up-and-up, Quiros approached Stenger with a scheme to purchase Jay Peak from MSSI by funneling the EB-5 money through a Miami brokerage firm to give the appearance that it was Quiros’ money being used to purchase Jay. At this time, attorneys for MSSI explicitly stated that EB-5 money couldn’t be used to purchase the property. Nevertheless, Quiros wasn’t about to give up hos free lunch. Stenger transferred $25 million in EB-5 funds meant to construct Phase I and II of the Jay Peak buildout from the accounts set up by MSSI to Quiros. Quiros purchased Jay Peak, amd every project going forward from this moment had to be run as a Ponzi scheme to “back fill” the $25 million hole in the financing due to Quiros’ misappropriation of funds to acquire the property in the first place.

In other words, the Miami guy, Quiros, didn’t have any skin in the game from the get-go, but took advantage of the EB-5 development program that Jay already had in place to “purchase” a large chunk of the Kingdom to enrich himself. By going along with the scheme, Stenger went from white-knight savior of the NEK, managing projects that were on the up and up, to a participant in securities fraud. As always with Ponzi schemes, a slowdown in recruitment of new investors in the later projects brought the whole house of cards tumbling down.

Love Jay Peak? Hate Jay Peak? You might enjoy this: The Real Jay Peak Snow Report

Harvey

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Administrator

Sick Bird Rider wrote

http://vtdigger.org/2016/04/14/quiros-stenger-accused-of-15-state-law-violations-too/

Woah, brain freeze

The thing is that people must get away with this stuff a lot for other to think they won't get caught. How could you possibly think you could get away with this? You have 350 mil and you only do 150 of construction. That should be pretty obvious?

"You just need to go at that shit wide open, hang on, and own it." —Camp

Sick Bird Rider

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Harvey wrote

Woah, brain freeze

No kidding. I can't even handle doing our tax return.

The really mind-boggling thing is how Quiros and Stenger ever thought this could all work out and that they would get away with it.

Funny thing, I followed up Bill S up the 52 steps of Stateside when I was last at Jay, he looked just like an aging resort manager in a cardigan, checking out how things were going. On a Sunday even. I thought, "good for you, Bill."

Love Jay Peak? Hate Jay Peak? You might enjoy this: The Real Jay Peak Snow Report

Sick Bird Rider

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Sick Bird Rider wrote

The really mind-boggling thing is how Quiros and Stenger ever thought this could all work out and that they would get away with it.

Harvey wrote

The thing is that people must get away with this stuff a lot for other to think they won't get caught. How could you possibly think you could get away with this? You have 350 mil and you only do 150 of construction. That should be pretty obvious?

Pop jinx. We must have been editing at the same time.

Love Jay Peak? Hate Jay Peak? You might enjoy this: The Real Jay Peak Snow Report

freeheeln

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

This post was updated on .

$200 million misused $50 million misappriated but this?
Susan Donegan, the commissioner of the Department of Financial Regulation, is seeking $185,000 in fines for seven alleged violations of the Vermont Uniform Securities Act and eight alleged violations of the Vermont Consumer Protection

Tele turns are optional not mandatory.

Harvey

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Administrator

http://vermont.craigslist.org/grd/5539110344.html

"You just need to go at that shit wide open, hang on, and own it." —Camp

Sick Bird Rider

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Harvey wrote

http://vermont.craigslist.org/grd/5539110344.html

SnoDad should pony up. Put Snoloco in charge, a la Quiros, trial by fire. What could go wrong?

Love Jay Peak? Hate Jay Peak? You might enjoy this: The Real Jay Peak Snow Report

raisingarizona

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

http://www.forbes.com/sites/antoinegara/2016/04/14/how-an-alleged-ski-resort-ponzi-scheme-exploited-a-growth-plan-once-championed-by-bernie-sanders/#63fd276bb172

Harvey

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

Administrator

This post was updated on .

Yeah and this too:

http://vtdigger.org/2016/04/15/governors-office-asks-that-old-emails-be-destroyed/

And this on Facebook from Ski The East's Editor:

"I have held back from a hot take on this until now. Here it is. The good guy (BS) got trapped by the bad guy (AQ) and taken on a ride he couldn't control. Good intentions and questionable accounting married him to a parter with very different plans. This is how I choose to view this until shown otherwise based on watching it since before it began. I also think Jay and Burke will emerge quite strong, quite soon. It serves all parties. Regardless of the outcome Bill Stenger is still a fine man."

"You just need to go at that shit wide open, hang on, and own it." —Camp

Re: Jay, Burke and EB-5

This post was updated on .

I totally called that this was totally unsustainable at Jay

Search "More expansion at Jay" thread from 2012.

I argued then that just because Jay can build all this that they should have. I made a case that that much infrastructure will not be profitable due to overhead.

The reason this failed is that they couldn't make a profit and had to keep raising eb5 funds just to cover the losses and pay back the earlier groups of investors. New jobs really were not being created at anywhere near what they claimed.

They will never find all this money Q was spending it and him and Stenler likely have millions shashed off shore in the Caymans.

Did Bernie know? Who knows but it is incumbent on him to do his due dilagence before supporting these crooks for the eb5 and clearly there was a lot of questionable shit Q had pulled. Big question is how much money did Bill and Q give to Bernies various campaigns.

if You French Fry when you should Pizza you are going to have a bad time

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