Park City / Canyons: 01/31 - 02/02/2016

I feel like the semi-snark gets more bang for the buck.

We've all got up on our pedestals and lectured this kid to death.  Maybe some of it gets to him by diffusion but I'm pretty sure he has his own ideas and his own ways of looking at this stuff, and until he actual experiences something, is not going to change his way of thinking.

He's a "show me" kind of guy.  He should move to Missouri...

He's also extremely good at pulling attention off the main focus of any discussion and turning it on himself.  Give him a little snark and move on or else he keeps posting stuff and devolving a good thread into a pointless discussion on researching resorts, mountain creek, bubble lifts or whatever happens to be running through his mind at that point in time.

We're all guilty of a little thread drifting, manipulation or steering, but this kid is like the iceberg that sunk the Titanic.

MikeK wrote

I think Sno has a real future in trolling ski forums...

Yeah, there's the risk I'm the loco one, wasting my words (many at that, but I'm bored on the train!) on an Internet forum, perhaps duped by a troll nonetheless!  Get a life, right!!!  But Sno doesn't strike me as a troll.  I've been around a few interweb forum blocks and seen plenty of trolls.  Sno's just strikes me as a typical misguided yute, as most yutes are....

Sorry I'm responding to this Jeff and negating anything I was trying to prove in the previous post...

No Sno isn't a troll (n), but he knows how to troll (v) pretty much everyone on this forum.  The difference between the noun and the verb is where the difference lies.

You are right Mike.  However, I've got kids Sno's age, so maybe that sucks me in.....

Interesting.....can troll-ish or troll-like be used as an (adj), allowing one's posts to be troll-ish, without purposely  engaging in the (v), by default making one the (n)?

As others have said, PC/Canyons sounds like a great change of pace if one is lucky enough to have a week to go skiing, hitting up a variety of Utah resorts.  If the opportunity arose I could see going there.  For my wife it's all about off hill stuff, and PC seems like a much better fit for that than Snowbird or Alta!  After Jeff's report is be more excited if the opportunity presented itself.

snoloco wrote

JTG4eva! wrote

I'm sorry, I might have missed something.....Sno, you've skied Vail, Breck and Keystone?

I haven't skied them and don't plan on it.  I did research all of them extensively as they were candidates for my trip this past December.  Breck was too high elevation for first time western skiers, Keystone didn't get enough snow, and Vail didn't have enough terrain for my mom (she only skis blue groomers which meant that she wouldn't get to see the back bowl or blue sky basin).  I'd probably go back to Steamboat again for my next trip, but try to get on more of the harder terrain.  After that, I'd step it up a notch and try Snowbird.  I may end up at Big Sky if I visit Montana State anytime soon.  I told my dad that I want to visit it in the winter.

Posted for posterity.

I highlighted a fine example of impressive cluelessness. Vail's green and blue terrain is about 400 acres smaller than all of Steamboat's acreage.

Vail is intermediate heaven. Your research ability sucks.

And you get to ski that acreage with thousands and thousands more skiers than we experienced at Steamboat.  The further away from Denver, the fewer people who you're sharing the runs with.

Adk Jeff wrote

snoloco wrote

Jeff mentioned in the other thread that he wouldn't pay to ski there either

Nope, never said that.

snoloco wrote

I thought you said that you wouldn't be skiing PC normally and went because it was free.  If you were paying, you'd have gone somewhere else.

What I said, Sno, was that Park City wouldn't be my first choice for snow or terrain, but that I'm happy to go along with the group decision that we made.  There's a more-than-subtle difference.

MikeK wrote

Sorry I'm responding to this Jeff and negating anything I was trying to prove in the previous post...

No worries at all.  No problem with the thread drift.

snoloco wrote

And you get to ski that acreage with thousands and thousands more skiers than we experienced at Steamboat.  The further away from Denver, the fewer people who you're sharing the runs with.

Agree, Steamboat is relatively uncrowded (but do not necessarily agree that Vail is).  We experienced zero lines at Park City / Canyons.  Everything was ski-on for all 3 days, with the exception of a sub-5 minute wait for the Canyons gondi on the 2 mornings that we started there.  On the other hand, there were some lines when we visited Alta / Snowbird 2 years ago.  Not terrible, but noticeably more that PC.  The bird tram of course had the biggest line, about a 15 minute wait each time we rode.

Harvey wrote

snoloco wrote

Breck was too high elevation for first time western skiers

I don't think how many times you've skied out west in the past has anything to do with how well you acclimate.  It's related to the elevation you came from, how much time you've spent up high (in the period directly before), staying hydrated/avoiding alcohol, and genetics. I think.

Well if you're doing anything for the first time, you tend to work your way up.  If you had never skied out west before, would you go to Jackson Hole and ride the tram to ski Corbett's Couloir for your first run?  No.  You'd start on the groomers as I did, and when comfortable, try the harder terrain.  Same thing goes with adjusting to altitude.  I thought it would be a better idea to sleep at 6,900 feet for my first time out west rather than over 9,000 feet.  Once I figured out how well I'd adjust to altitude (which I did quite well), then I can be open to sleeping at a higher elevation than I did previously.  You're attitude is that when you first try something that you should immediately jump into the deep end and not do something less extreme first.

Adk Jeff wrote

snoloco wrote

And you get to ski that acreage with thousands and thousands more skiers than we experienced at Steamboat.  The further away from Denver, the fewer people who you're sharing the runs with.

Agree, Steamboat is relatively uncrowded (but do not necessarily agree that Vail is).  We experienced zero lines at Park City / Canyons.  Everything was ski-on for all 3 days, with the exception of a sub-5 minute wait for the Canyons gondi on the 2 mornings that we started there.  On the other hand, there were some lines when we visited Alta / Snowbird 2 years ago.  Not terrible, but noticeably more that PC.  The bird tram of course had the biggest line, about a 15 minute wait each time we rode.

Aside from the gondola which slowed and stopped constantly all day every day, Steamboat has no lines that are long by eastern standards, even during a holiday week.  It's great that there were no lines anywhere for you.  Normally when Vail buys a mountain, it gets way more crowded due to the sheer number of people with the Epic Pass who can now ski there.  Maybe Coach was trying to help you out by scaring others away from Park City so you could have minimal crowds.  I've always liked mountains with high speed lifts and low crowds, so maybe he'll continue to make those comments in case I (cough, cough, cough) ski there sometime in the future.

"Normally when Vail buys a mountain, it gets way more crowded due to the sheer number of people with the Epic Pass who can now ski there."

There you go again!!!!  Let me ask, how many studies on Vail acquisitions have you undertaken to evaluate pre and post acquisition skier visits?  Maybe you've done that as a school assignment?  How much empirical or scientific research (the real kind, like you'll do in college) have you performed on the subject?  Hint, Internet "research".....the kind where you pick up a tidbit of info from some yahoo, who picked it up from some other yahoo, which you then spread like a yahoo.....that doesn't count!

You make statements of fact, or at least very strong opinion, like you are some ski industry expert when, in fact, you don't really know squat.  Put you in a room, real or virtual, with anyone who has any knowledge or experience and you come across as that yahoo, foolish.  You don't want that, nor can you afford that.

Look at it this way, because you are looking toward college and seem to have your head screwed on straight on the subject.  Now an admissions interview is never going to get you in to a school, but it can keep you out.  My daughter is in the application process and just had her Brown alumni interview.  It went great, but her ACT isn't a 33 so she probably isn't getting in, but at least she didn't blow the interview.  Why did it go so well?  She identified some common interests in theatre and music (as in instrument, not artists) with the interviewer, allowing them to have a very organic conversation that sped an hour by and answered all of both of their questions without either of them ever really asking any questions.  I love when I do employment interviews with candidates and they go like that.  So, she demonstrated her passions in a way that was atypical of what most prospective students do, the interviewer told her such.  How does that apply to you?  Well, you have a great passion for skiing.  Maybe you come across an interviewer with a similar passion, allowing you to share information on the subject.  Well, if you share ski related information in an interview the way you do around here a knowledgeable person is going to leave saying "damn, that kid is a totally immature nut job!".  You don't want that report in your admissions file!

Yes, I'm on the train again with time to kill......but don't worry, I think I'm headed to snark mode.....

Ok, I do make statements in a stronger way than I intend.  Let's just say that I've heard many times that when Vail buys a Mountain, it gets more crowded.  It's common sense as well.  If a bunch of people who didn't have a pass there now do, there are going to be more people there.  Hunter is noticibly more crowded this year since it was added to the Noreaster Pass at no charge.  I'd imagine some Noreaster passholders who normally ski Mount Snow or Jack Frost/Big Boulder now ski some days at Hunter, since it's exactly in the middle of them.  Don't know the exact numbers, but I'm speaking from experience.  Your attitude is that I shouldn't say a word on this topic unless I'm the CEO of the company that runs the mountain.  If that was the case, this forum would not exist.  I've always been into the business behind skiing, so I'm going to post some of my ideas on it.  Don't like it?  Then ask Harvey to create an ignore list.

snoloco wrote

Your attitude is that I shouldn't say a word on this topic unless I'm the CEO of the company that runs the mountain.  If that was the case, this forum would not exist.  I've always been into the business behind skiing, so I'm going to post some of my ideas on it.  Don't like it?  Then ask Harvey to create an ignore list.

And Loco totally misses the point!  Why doesn't that surprise me?  Actually, everything you said in that last post up to the part I quoted made me think you actually heard something, because the way you restated your observations and inferences on Vail, and tied in your actual experience with Hunter's situation was MUCH better than the type of ridiculous statements you usually make!  Alas, all you heard was "blah, blah, blah, this guy doesn't want me to say anything".  You couldn't be further from the truth.

Carry on, my wayward son.......I'm out!

Has there ever been a Park City trip report > Brown University admissions transition before in the history of the internet? Or is this uncharted territory?

If Vail buys every ski area they'll all be more crowded, good for the industry

witch hobble wrote

Has there ever been a Park City trip report > Brown University admissions transition before in the history of the internet? Or is this uncharted territory?

We're definitely sinking the unsinkable ship (hence my Titanic reference earlier).

Best pictures of the season ---> Mtn Creek ---> ??? (I stopped reading).

I just went back and looked at the pictures.

Jeff - how did you tolerate those horrible crowds?

billyymc wrote

I just went back and looked at the pictures.
Jeff - how did you tolerate those horrible crowds?

Biggest "line" was hiking up Jupiter Peak:

OMG that line was SOOOOOOOOOO long.  You would have been better off going to Disney  

No just kidding, no lines+high speed lifts=good.

Back to the actual TR discussion.

My crew was right behind Jeff. I would post my own TR, but I pulled a Darwin award and left my pocket unzipped the first day at POWMOW. I would have been better off leaving the phone at home and doing the all day powder cat. Still waiting to hear that someone found it somewhere in powder country.........

One of my buddies and I got in Tuesday night and headed straight for Ogden. It was too late to grab a bite to eat, but we were able to grab a few beers. Ogden seems to be on the up and up with a bunch of bars, restaurants, arts and entertainment in the center of town. In the morning we got a semi early start for the 40 minute trip to POWMOW. POWMOW continues to be one of my favorite places in Utah. We skied untracked lines in powder country and off James Peak / Lightning ridge from 9:30-4:15. The terrain off Paradise was also fantastic. The only mistake we made was doing the hike/traverse around cobabe canyon. Not worth the 20 minutes IMO. Very low angle meadow skipping. The rest of the day was amazing. $44 tickets on Wednesdays. $20 cat rides. Untouched inbounds POW lines.

Thursday-Sunday we skied PCMR/Canyons. We didn't quite have the snow that Jeff had, but it was still fantastic. It was my best trip to Park City yet. I think part of that has to do with learning which pods to head for and which ones to avoid. If you focus on the payday, crescent, king kon, silver load, bonanza terrain you will get a bit more of the Stratton/killington feel. If you head for the trees of motherload, mckonkeys, Jupiter, porcupine ridge (off Gondi or off Jupiter, peak 5, 9990, condor you will never wait in a line and you will have a good time. I think the connection gondola was a fantastic addition. It really didn't take that long to go back and forth and it certainly would have taken longer to take the shuttle from one base to the other and get to the same terrain. We hiked a few times on porcupine ridge which had chest high powder along the ridge. The only way the connection could be better is if they had put the gondola further up the ridge towards Jupiter. It would make the porcupine access much easier.

On Sunday I alternated laps between the 9990 lift and peak 5. Ski on all day and there was hardly anybody on that part of the mountain. Not too many places that I know of where you can ride a high speed quad to expert only terrain (and side country access). On my way back to the Gondi I realized that there are some nice trees off saddleback along with surprisingly good terrain off dreamcatcher and flatiron. More stuff to explore next year.

For a guys trip (or family trip) where you want to balance fun and entertainment with great skiing then I would recommend PC. If you can swing staying somewhere in historic park city I highly recommend it. Not too many towns (in the US) where you can roll out of bed and walk to the lift and then ski back home and hit a few après places on the way.