$20M for Whiteface and Gore + $8M for Belle

http://www.firsttracksonline.com/2017/01/23/cuomo-announces-upgrades-at-gore-and-whiteface-totaling-20m/

And no snowmaking upgrades for either mountain.  BS

I don't care about zip lines or mountain coasters.  Even lodge upgrades don't matter all that much, plus I don't go to Kids Kampus anyways.

I don't like the idea of installing a lift from Kids Kampus to Midstation because it creates even more trail crowding in that area of the mountain which is already overcrowded

No mention of upgrading the High Peaks lift at Gore either.  Hope it lasts another year without falling apart.

Looks like ORDA has now subscribed to the very negative non skiing emphasis that many other resorts are taking up.

CONTENTS DELETED

WF already has the best off hill activities in the east in LP.  I don't see why they need more.  This could also negatively affect the town by keeping people spending money on the mountain instead of in LP.

Snowmaking should be top priority followed by lift and trail upgrades.  Everything else is low priority.

Did Les Otten donate to Cuomo's reelection?

Lookout still isn't open, and they're pissing away money on building a zipline and roller coaster.  Imagine if just 1 million of this large investment was spent on snowmaking at each mountain.  We'd definitely have all the lifts open by now.

A lift from Kids Kampus to midstation is one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard.  There's one trail there that sends you back to KK and that's Boreen, headwall included.  It's already crowded enough as is and now they want to dump even more people out there.  Just upgrade the lift on the existing route if they really need to build another lift.

This whole thing is more proof that NY should NOT be in the skiing business.

Adk Jeff wrote

The improvements to the Saddle Lodge and former gondi terminal at the summit are much needed improvements to Gore.  Both should have been done years ago.  The rest of the $20M is wasted money.

Government wasting money?   Nahhhhhh......

A friggin mountain coaster?  Who wants to see a whole bunch of rollercoaster tracks amongst such great views of mountains and nature.  At least the zipline isn't so noticeable.

Not digging the emphasis on non-skiing model...this is sad...like Whiteface losing its identity. Or becoming VT....

snoloco wrote

Did Les Otten donate to Cuomo's reelection?

 

This is the best part:

Building the longest mountain coaster in the United States

Because god knows that's completely essential!

snoloco wrote

Snowmaking should be top priority followed by lift and trail upgrades.  Everything else is low priority.

I couldn't agree more. Both mountains are in need of snowmaking upgrades desperately. They've got a lot of catching up to do in order to be competitive with a a place like Killington, or Stowe which have 3x the capability.

I think I'll need to change the petition in my signature line.

It's such bullshit that they can't make glades above 2,800 feet yet they can clearcut an entire area to punch in a roller coaster.  Where the hell would they even put it?  If you want a roller coaster, go to Six Flags in Montreal or Lake George.

They actually think that these money drains will help bring in more skiers.  No they won't.  They'll just take money from local businesses in LP.  You know what would bring in skiers and retain visitors?  Opening all lifts for Christmas (or at least MLK Weekend) every year.  I guess now they think that the skiing doesn't matter anymore because if people don't like it they'll just ride the roller coaster instead.  Guess what,  I don't give a fuck about mountain coasters (or zip lines, or restaurants, or corporate rooms).  I rode Mountain Creek's like twice in 5 years in the winter and I only did it because it was free.  I care about nothing but the skiing, and things related to it (snowmaking, grooming, lifts, adequate lodge facilities).  What's next?  Building a waterpark?

When I first saw the article on facebook, I got excited...then I read it and it was going OK until I saw zipline, thought, OK that's not end of the world just a cable...Then saw the words mountain coaster and shit my pants.

What happened to Forever Wild and all that....?

I had the same reaction.  When I saw no mention of snowmaking upgrades, my face went red and steam came out of my ears.

Lookout, Burnt Ridge, and the Ski Bowl were scams to up the skiable acreage.  They clearly don't care about the viability of those expansions if they're just going to market them to get people on the mountain, but put money into roller coasters and zip lines instead.

It's one thing to not have the money for 100% snowmaking right away.  It's another thing to have that money, but waste it on non essential, non skiing related things.

The upgrades at Gore seem reasonable enough, the lodges are very dated and a facility (other than a rotting outhouse with no TP) is needed at the summit. The upgrades to WF - not so much.

all this would first need to get APA approval for things like the zip lines and coaster and are easy to chuck over the side if that goes sideways which it well should.  A mt coaster is simply the stupidest thing I've seen come out of Orda well - like EVER and I have seen some pretty stupid stuff working there for 17 years.

Its been the plan for some time to move all the ski teaching activity over to Kids Kampus aka Bear's Den.  To make that happen they would need a bigger lodge and more food service and a bar.  They also badly need a lift upgrade out of there to make it more interconnected with the main side so the lift does make some sense.  The key to making that all work would be that they would also need to improve and commit to blowing snow on the Boreen headwall bypass.  There is not much room for a lift terminus around Mid.  That area already is very crowded with all those intersections.  Might make more sense to have it end  just below the look out lifts loading station which could be widened out a bit there and it would have to be high enough to get to the that by pass I mentioned above.

Asking us to over to the KK is probably a deal killer with a lot of staff as well.  I'm not sure I would do it at this point.  I used to be based up there and its a pain in the butt.

Adk Jeff wrote

The improvements to the Saddle Lodge and former gondi terminal at the summit are much needed improvements to Gore.  Both should have been done years ago.  The rest of the $20M is wasted money.  A doubling of both mountains' snowmaking capacity (or at least 50% increase), improvements in the connectivity of the Burnt Ridge and Ski Bowl pods at Gore, and cutting the final trail in the Lookout pod at WF should be priorities and are not even mentioned.

+1

Sadly, this is typical of government priorities. Spend on what people see so it looks like you are doing something. In NJ we have lots of new gyms in inner city schools.

The poor conditions over MLK weekend should have been a wake-up call for snowmaking improvements.

tom

Guys - you missed the new gondola!   NY is getting one!  

http://www.syracuse.com/state/index.ssf/2017/01/cuomo_state_fair_budget_gondola_lakeview_amphitheater_onondaga.html

Hopefully they throw out the roller coaster idea and spend the money on snowmaking upgrades instead.  The 3rd Lookout trail is already approved, and upgrading pumping and air capacity doesn't need APA approval.

To get a lift out of Kids Kampus to connect with the rest of the mountain, they'd need to go over that ridge where Wilmington Trail runs.  That would be a very steep and expensive route to build on.  Just extend the existing line and have a new trail out onto Boreen.

This kind of matches the recent other drunking spending binges by the Gov up here.  Blowing big sums on Plattsburgh and the crazy plans for Frontier Town.  Spending money for the hell of it so he can get in the news without regard if they are really good investments for the tax payers.  Where the heck is all this money coming from anyway that he is giving out?  Looks like he is positioning himself to run for President next time around.

As for Whiteface......A zip line and mountain coaster will do nothing to upgrade facilities which are, as admitted in the announcement, outdated and subpar.  They can get to world class skiing, or they can try and be more of a year round resort, but going for both with a (relatively) small infusion is unwise.  Skip the zip and toast the coaster.  Of course if Albany is giving the money and telling you what to spend it on......well, you take the money and do as they say, I guess.

The improvements at Bear Den and running a lift to mid mountain actually can serve the purpose of improving the ski experience throughout the resort, maybe.  By expanding facilities there and increasing the terrain that can be directly accessed from Bear Den it could make it a more viable base of instruction operations, further distancing it from its Kids Kampus heritage, and it could shift skier traffic away from the main base.