COVID 19 impact on skiing

Same publisher different article.The day skiing died: Inside the historic day coronavirus forced Colorado’s ski industry to shutter
https://coloradosun.com/2020/04/15/colorado-ski-resorts-shutdown-backstory/

trackbiker wrote

If you look at most class action lawsuits the lawyers get millions and you get a coupon for 50 cents or something else negligible. How many of those letters have you gotten, "If you've used so and so in the last X years you may be entitled to part of a class action settlement."? There's too many lawyers in this country. The problem is you don't need much to train a lawyer like a doctor or scientist who need labs and equipment. All you need is books and a classroom. Not all lawyers are bad but these ambulance chaser sorts just cost us all money in insurance premiums. They just make work for themselves by suing people that they know will settle rather than go through the cost of a court battle. If we made it so the loser pays these type of lawsuits would go away. But then who makes up the largest part of state and federal legislalures?

Tort reform has not worked in Texas. In 2003, there were multiple limits placed on medical lawsuits. Studies have shown that this has not reduced the Texas malpractice insurance losses when compared to peer states.

"Using a difference-in-differences (DD) analysis, we find evidence that the Texas tort reform measures enacted in 2003 had little influence on the levels of health insurance losses per enrollee incurred by Texas health insurers. Our results provide support for our null hypothesis that reform measures in the medical malpractice market did not have a significant, persistent effect on health insurance losses."
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5701901/

Lawyers can be the last line of protection against corporate malfeasance, doctor malpractice, and a host of other problems that can eff up our lives. Taking the word of some trade organization is laughable. Unfortunately, lawyers can act criminally, too. There are no easy answers.

I am not a lawyer and I do not work in the insurance world.

Leadership:

https://skiing.substack.com/p/magic-resets-northeast-season-pass

Harvey wrote

 Leadership: https://skiing.substack.com/p/magic-resets-northeast-season-pass

Wow, that's a lot of info.

Great pic of the Red Chair. I may have mentioned before that when I was skiing there in the early 00s, people were making jokes about how old and slow it was (I remember someone on TGR wrote "my 13-year-old golden retriever with bad hips can limp uphill faster than that chair"), and here we are in 2020/it's still there.

Peter Minde wrote

I'm no fan of insurance companies.  But our auto carrier is going to refund a portion of the policy fee due to the pandemic.  This, in spite of the fact that I had to file a claim this year.  Other driver was at fault....

Our is doing the same. Their profits are likely soaring with premiums the same, and accident down to near zero.

Wonder if when it all opens up, people drop the top on the convertible, open it up, and dent the fenders enough to wipe out the additional profit.

Harvey wrote

Peter Minde wrote

I'm no fan of insurance companies.  But our auto carrier is going to refund a portion of the policy fee due to the pandemic.  This, in spite of the fact that I had to file a claim this year.  Other driver was at fault....

Our is doing the same. Their profits are likely soaring with premiums the same, and accident down to near zero.

Wonder if when it all opens up, people drop the top on the convertible, open it up, and dent the fenders enough to wipe out the additional profit.

Road trip with the sunroof open and King Crimson on the CD player.  You know where I'm headed.

Harvey wrote

Peter Minde wrote

I'm no fan of insurance companies.  But our auto carrier is going to refund a portion of the policy fee due to the pandemic.  This, in spite of the fact that I had to file a claim this year.  Other driver was at fault....

Our is doing the same. Their profits are likely soaring with premiums the same, and accident down to near zero.

Wonder if when it all opens up, people drop the top on the convertible, open it up, and dent the fenders enough to wipe out the additional profit.

Don't be so sure their profits are up. Insurance is a financial business, and the companies maintain large investment funds to pay out expected losses.  The losses on those investments are likely to wipe out any reduced claims.

mm

Meanwhile in Vermont, not really impact to skiing (may have been posted already if so sorry) but: https://www.wcax.com/content/news/Vermont-State-Colleges-System-likely-to-close-3-campuses-569727971.html

IKON just let everyone who is purchasing a 20/21 pass know they can defer that purchase for the 21/22 season.  That's a great option if we can't get a handle on this by the winter.

Saratogahalfday wrote

IKON just let everyone who is purchasing a 20/21 pass know they can defer that purchase for the 21/22 season.  That's a great option if we can't get a handle on this by the winter.

This got me back on board for purchasing for next season. Great option and hedges bets in the event next season doesn't happen or looks like it will get started really late.

So, just to save a hundred bucks, you're going to buy ahead to the season after next? What's the rush? Can't you see that they're desperate for cash flow? Wait until December or whatever the cut off date is for sales, you'll have a better idea how things are going.

No doubting it, I know you study this stuff. How do we know they are tight on cash?

In a vacuum, I'd guess that with spring skiing cut and capital improvements on hold, they'd be ok cash wise at this moment.

Regarding skiers POV, If I was unemployed, or pay cut, or in danger of same, I'd never buy a pass now.

If I was 100% secure, but unsure that the next season happening, I'd never buy a pass.

I see no reason to buy a pass now. What's the worst thing that happens? All returns to normal and you pay full price for a pass? So then you have to ski like hell to pay it off.  Seems like a pretty good worst case scenario.

Spot on Harv : Hold your powder dry right now and see what happens ... It is strictly discretionery spending , NOT a NEED .  Simply  Too many other winter  diversions that are freebies: .BC , XC , snow shoeing , fat tire biking if you already own one calling SBR 😉, skating, up here i seen some ski joring

 FWIW : i got some crazy ass friends that have kayaked or canoed down a local ski hill , 😂 That was epic !  
The silly bastages hit minor jumps that the kids had built for their snowboards  on a local ski bump ski hill .The next day the"jadrools   " could hardly stand up straight when they taught class.😆😆😆

If I buy IKON now, I have until early December to move the pass to the following season, so there's no risk in my eyes.

That assumes that there is no chance you will need the money, in the short or medium term.

I'm speaking as an consumer, not as an avid supporter of the ski industry, which I am.

Also I'm encouraged by your consumer confidence.  It's an asset to the economy as a whole.

Also, let's say, worst case scenario and next season is canceled. Then say, Alterra Or Vail sells off some of those resorts before the 21-21 season...the ones that you like and plan to ski?  I believe you'd be shit out of luck?  You'd be in the same position as those who had the lifetime Killington season passes, no?

Certainly, no reason to buy now...at least wait until the deadline is approaching to get a better picture of the what the world looks like and, as others have said above (Harv, Warp), get a better idea of what your personal financial position is like.    

https://unofficialnetworks.com/2020/04/22/california-ski-resort-mt-baldy-reopens-for-skiing/

Unofficial wrote

Similar to how a golf course operates Mt Baldy will check-in a maximum of 4 individuals at 10 minute intervals. 1 Day Alpine Ticketed guests will have access to Lift #2 and #3 from that time until closing. In stark contrast to a golf course (150 acres), Mt Baldy Resort (800 acres) has more than 4x the area and will be operating at less than 10% of occupancy under this plan.

Could totally redefine the idea of first tracks.  Hate to see capitalism get a hold of this.

A skier from LA on another forum will be there, I'm sure. Assuming that he beats the likely crowd and makes it on the lift, I'll make sure his TR is cross-posted.

https://www.powder.com/interview/skiing-and-the-pandemic-will-new-zealand-have-a-ski-season/

Thanks for that article/interview. Amongst all this, I hadn't even thought about the southern hemisphere approaching the start of their ski season. On a side note, the author of that article, Devon O'neil, is a friend and co-worker from my ski bum days in Breckenridge (2012-2018). If you want to kill some time, he writes killer pieces in the skiing and mountain biking realm.