Ideas for Ski Area Improvements

More Gore improvements!!

This plan is to shorten the flat spot at the very summit that you need to take to get to Cloud which takes you to Rumor, Lies, and Open Pit, all trails that are lapped off the Straightbrook Quad.

The current setup is shown in blue.  My plan is to demolish the old gondola building and remove some trees in that same area.  The new route is shown in white.




The large flat area created by demolishing the gondola building would allow for a new summit lodge to be built.  I'd build a 3 level lodge with bathrooms in the basement, a cafeteria on the ground floor, and a restaurant and bar on the top floor with 360 degree views.  The goal is to allow for Gore's mountain areas to be more evenly utilized.  During the ski day, this would allow for expert skiers to stay at the summit to eat and not need to go all the way down to the base or saddle if they didn't want to.  After the ski day was over, the restaurant could offer a "sunset dinner" experience where you ride up in a snowcat, similar to what Steamboat does with their Four Points Lodge.  Stuff like that could draw in some of the "money is no object" crowd which would help fund even more improvements.

Sno,
You need to go to Alta, they have this rotating rope tow that has no attendants that carries people in both directions across the base area. If Gore brought the summit lift back to the volley ball court they should install one of these to take people back and forth.  

Don't destroy the old gondola. I think they should clean it up, replace the roof, and use the old gondola frame as a Bar. The bar will be build around the frame, and the surrounding area will just be a nice summit lodge. It's gonna be rustic, but definitely the coolest summit lodge ever. With some clean up, it would be very nice.

Sno, you got any ideas for Woodstream improvements?

Never skied Woodstream, so I am unqualified to give any ideas for improvements.  I have over 20 days at Gore, not as many as some people on here, but enough to know the place relatively well.  My take is that you own Woodstream, so you can do anything there that you can plan out and pay for.  I'd love to run a ski area and that's why I post about these things.

The gondola building is far too small to be a lodge with full food-service.  It also creates a long flat spot that doesn't need to be there.  Not sure if it's structurally sound either.

Another benefit of having a summit lodge with a restaurant is a first tracks/breakfast setup would be possible.  Although I'm generally not a fan of paid first tracks, I think it could work pretty well at Gore.  Any ski areas that I'd run would open at 8am on weekends for everyone.  That's plenty early to get the crowds spread out quickly.  Let's say for $45 per person you get breakfast at the summit lodge and early access to select trails.  Load the gondola at 7:15 (45 minutes before the public), get exclusive access to Topridge and Straightbrook lifts and the trails they serve, and show your first tracks ticket at the summit lodge and get free breakfast.  Sell 200 of these tickets and that's $9,000 dollars in revenue, and I guarantee it would sell out on powder days.  I wouldn't pay for it every day, but I think it would be pretty cool to do that a couple times a season.  

As Gore is so big, this wouldn't make first tracks "paid and not earned.  Only the Topridge and Straightbrook areas would get tracked out.  Everyone else would still have all of the Dark Side, North Side, Burnt Ridge, and Ski Bowl that had not been touched by those who paid for first tracks.

snoloco wrote

Never skied Woodstream, so I am unqualified to give any ideas for improvements.  I have over 20 days at Gore, not as many as some people on here, but enough to know the place relatively well.  My take is that you own Woodstream, so you can do anything there that you can plan out and pay for.  I'd love to run a ski area and that's why I post about these things.

The gondola building is far too small to be a lodge with full food-service.  It also creates a long flat spot that doesn't need to be there.  Not sure if it's structurally sound either.

Another benefit of having a summit lodge with a restaurant is a first tracks/breakfast setup would be possible.  Although I'm generally not a fan of paid first tracks, I think it could work pretty well at Gore.  Any ski areas that I'd run would open at 8am on weekends for everyone.  That's plenty early to get the crowds spread out quickly.  Let's say for $45 per person you get breakfast at the summit lodge and early access to select trails.  Load the gondola at 7:15 (45 minutes before the public), get exclusive access to Topridge and Straightbrook lifts and the trails they serve, and show your first tracks ticket at the summit lodge and get free breakfast.  Sell 200 of these tickets and that's $9,000 dollars in revenue, and I guarantee it would sell out on powder days.  I wouldn't pay for it every day, but I think it would be pretty cool to do that a couple times a season.  

As Gore is so big, this wouldn't make first tracks "paid and not earned.  Only the Topridge and Straightbrook areas would get tracked out.  Everyone else would still have all of the Dark Side, North Side, Burnt Ridge, and Ski Bowl that had not been touched by those who paid for first tracks.

You ate too many of Nepa's brownies

Sno, what do you think about making improvements to the Northside at Gore? I think opening the North side would be a priority as soon as possible and definitely by christmas. It holds snow well, and doesn't take a large amount of snow to cover. I think they should focus on opening that immediately after Showcase, and Sunway, and keeping it open as late in the spring as possible. If it's a bad season, just focus on the ADK express, and the Northside for Christmas, and forget the gondola until ready to tackle Topridge, and Straightbrook.  Maybe even put in a High speed quad on the Northside. The current lift is a little long. I'd like to see snowmaking be a priority on Pete Gay, Powder pass, Sleeping Bear, and Tahawus. I think they all have plumbing as it is, it's just way under utilized. If I was a skier looking to ski on christmas break, and I knew I had two HSQs, and 2-3 trails off of each of them, I would dig it. It just seems like a better early season plan.

I've posted this plan before.  The lift upgrades needed are High Peaks Chair replaced with new double, HSQ on North Side, and North Quad gets relocated to replace Sunway.  Opening plan using this year's dates if the weather was decent.  All lifts open by Christmas.  Follow this lift schedule and open as many trails as possible on each section.

11/21:  ADK Express, Sunway Quad. Terrain for all abilities is available right out of the gate.  This is a desirable setup for skiers to lap and gives lots of flexibility due to weather.  Good year, open the entire front side.  Bad year, focus resources on Showcase and Sunway.

11/27:  Gondola, Topridge Triple.  Start expanding toward the Summit.  Get the signature lift running for Thanksgiving.

12/5:  Straightbrook Quad.  Get the Summit open and get set to expand to the north.  Open the proposed Summit Lodge for the season as well.

12/13:  North Express Quad.  Open this important section of family friendly terrain.  Get set to open Burnt Ridge and the Dark Side.

12/19:  High Peaks Double.  This doesn't take much snow and allows resources to be used to open the massive Burnt Ridge section (which would have 5 long wide trails).

12/24:  Burnt Ridge Express Quad.  Open a huge section of terrain right before the holidays.  Set up to open the Ski Bowl.

12/26:  Hudson Triple, Village Triple.  Connect the ski terrain to the town when the crowds arrive.


I know, people will flame me saying "WHAT ABOUT THIS YEAR OR OTHER BAD YEARS.  YOURE CRAZY AND SPOILED".  This schedule is meant to represent a mediocre to average year, not THE WORST start to a year on record.

Something else I came up with, this time in the tree skiing department:

Some glades on Burnt Ridge might be lost to create all the new trails that I mentioned earlier (although hopefully as few as possible).  

To make up for this, make the Dark Side area between Steilhang and Cloud all glades between the existing trails.  It has high elevation and favorable exposure, so they'd be open most consistently of any glades on the mountain.  

The North Side also has a favorable exposure.  Maybe the area between Sleeping Bear and Tahawas can be gladed.  This would be a good way to introduce new people to tree skiing.  It's not very steep and it's in between two trails, so impossible to go out of bounds.  Since it isn't steep, it wouldn't be hard for it to open.

Ethan Snow wrote

definitely the coolest summit lodge ever. With some clean up, it would be very nice.

Myself, I would move over to the very summit where it would have absolutely wondrous views all around, High peaks, VT, S Adks. This time of year, the outside deck would friggen rock, people would flock to it and Harv would be posting tons of pics of everybody hanging out. There it would truly be a signature lodge and " definitely the coolest summit lodge ever ".

Moving OLD, lightweight ( dried out ) buildings like this one is surprisingly easy. Even a tear down/rebuild isn't huge - it's just a shell. Gore could get mega volunteer help for this.

Skiing off SB would be soooo much nicer without that building blocking the skier's path.

Uhm, I'm pretty sure there glades right next to Tahawus as it is. Not to say however, that glade on the other side would be pointless

Then maybe have it between Pete Gay and Powder Pass/North Star.  That would be a bit different.

Yeah, that would be a great place for an easy glade with a favorable aspect

Ethan Snow wrote

Yeah, that would be a great place for an easy glade with a favorable aspect

That was my thought.  Good place to learn tree skiing.


I rerouted my proposed Cirque trail to shorten the runout, give it better views, and hopefully stay away from the existing glade.  It has the arrow pointed at it.  Does it clearcut the glade where I have it now?  My impression is that the glade is in the valley to lookers left where I have the trail.  My old route went right through that valley.

Snoloco, you seem to be into google earth maps, and I am very much in to Sketchup. I also use other more advanced CADD software, but there is nothing more fun and versatile as Sketchup. Especially when it comes to ski areas. I can actually import topography to Sketchup from Google Earth, and put stuff on it such as a new ski lift, or some snow guns.

So, how about we make your ideas a virtual reality even if it never happens in real life?

For starters, here is a Hall ski lift that I'm working on. Believe me though, we can deal with HS lifts too.



What do you think?

Hand meet glove.

snoloco wrote

Something else I came up with, this time in the tree skiing

To make up for this, make the Dark Side area between Steilhang and Cloud all glades between the existing trails.  It has high elevation and favorable exposure, so they'd be open most consistently of any glades on the mountain.  

Hard to believe that no one ever thought of that. ?

Ethan Snow wrote

Yeah, that would be a great place for an easy glade with a favorable aspect

Like the way you think. Wish that Gore would hire a full time glade caretaker, certainly a need for that position. If only there was a noted local that fit the bill.

^^Funny and sad at the same time.

snoloco wrote

...make the Dark Side area between Steilhang and Cloud all glades between the existing trails.  It has high elevation and favorable exposure, so they'd be open most consistently of any glades on the mountain.  

That's just funny.  

Can I name it?

Harvey:  I'd let you name it, or any glades that I add for that matter, as long as that keeps you at Gore after the other improvements are made.  You can't name it and then run away to Plattekill or MRG.

Ethan:  Looks like a cool software.  Looks like you're using a mac.  I use a PC and I'm not sure if it works on one.