Retirement Dreams

We are in an affordable town in north NJ.  We hope the health insurance gap of early retirement is solved before we need to cover the years before 65. One idea we have is to rent for a month (summer or winter) or so in areas that have good access to outdoor activities. There are number of areas that interest us - Reno, Boise, Bend,  and even NEPA's spot - Wenachtee. Retiring in NJ means access to NYC via mass transit, top health care, and a big family and friends support system. North NJ also means decent access to east coast midweek skiing. Maybe at some point we will want to bail on the expense and weather and move south. That is always an option.

nepa wrote

Z wrote

I like Bend a lot but it would be better for MC than me given it’s a very blue state

 
Z.  I think you'd like it on this side of the Cascades.  There is no state income tax, ultra-cheap electricity, and our property taxes are quite low.  Legal weed has even lead to a couple of reductions over the past few years.  I nearly fell over when I saw Jason's tax bill... I live in a fairly large house, and have never paid more than 4k annually.  15k seems almost unconstitutional.

 15 is reasonable..have friends that pay close to 35k..
all this will eventually come back to destroy the area

nepa wrote

15k seems almost unconstitutional.

JasonWx wrote

15 is reasonable..have friends that pay close to 35k..

How many square feet?

nepa wrote

15k seems almost unconstitutional.

Jeebus, I know!

I pay less than 5k for school and property in the same state.

What do you get for that 15k?  Gold lined streets?  Guilded sewers?


So anyway - most of that is the town and county, NOT the state, as is evident by my much, much more modest tax bill.

Harvey wrote

JasonWx wrote

15 is reasonable..have friends that pay close to 35k..

How many square feet?

4500 sqf on about a acre

Ours is about $9k and we have 1000 square feet on a postage stamp.  That is 75% school tax and I think it is worth it for us NOW that we have a kid in school. Comparable private schools are five times as much and you are still paying the property tax anyway. All those years when I had no kid, maybe harder to justify.

As someone said upthread, I really like the town I live in and I have been walking to work for 25 years so that is something.

In places without property tax how do they pay for schools?

EDIT: 4500 on the 15k or 35k?

I have 2700sqf on .30 acres..15k

Harvey wrote

Ours is about $9k and we have 1000 square feet.  That is 75% school tax and I think it is worth it for us NOW that we have a kid in school. Comparable private schools are five times as much and you are still paying the property tax anyway. All those years when I had no kid, maybe harder to justify.

As someone said upthread, I really like the town I live in and I have been walking to work for 25 years so that is something.

I have 3 kids.  I just paid the school tax bill: $2400.  And I thought that sucked when I didn't have kids.  Now i don't complain as much.

Property is just under what school tax is and I just got a NYS property tax relief check for $335 for last year.  And everyone still complains up here.

It is a lot - but when I think of snow removal alone, we get a lot of services for that money.  And during summer it seems like all we do is rebuild roads!

My house is about 1400 sf, 0.2 acre.  Honestly, I don't need more space, but with 3 kids, I wish it was set up for 4 bedrooms instead of 3.

So you get a separate property and school tax bill?

Harvey wrote

So you get a separate property and school tax bill?

Yup.  School bill comes in August, property comes in December.  Merry Christmas!

This is only if you don't have an escrow account and pay them lump sum.  I've done this from the beginning and even when I tried to switch my mortgage company was not very responsive, so I said hell with it.  It saves you a little interest fee.

My $9k is all in. I pay quarterly and it includes school tax.

Honestly I'd trade the band and orchestra for a cop.  

JasonWx wrote

I have 2700sqf on .30 acres..15k

We have 4500sqf on just about an acre.  This year's bill is 3850, which includes school.

Conversely, I still have a house back East, less than 1/2 the size of our WA house, and we pay 7500.  There is no signs of anything getting better... we were just informed that there would be a 7.5% increase next year.  On top of property tax, if you rent my house, you pay a city wage tax, on top of the state income tax.  We have to keep the rent low in order to keep it occupied.  It's a nice house (3 bdrms,3.5 baths, high-end everything), but the city/county where it is located are poorly managed and riddled with corruption.  On paper, it's going to be a 6 figure loss.  Over the past few years, I have had a couple of investment wins and the plan was to offset the gains by unloading this loser, but unfortunately, it won't sell even at fire sale pricing.    

I put the school tax in the mail today...I haven't had kids in the system for 4 yrs..but without a good school system my property value would suffer..

that being said we are being squeeze by Hassic and Orthodox jews who keep trying to buy into Clarkstown. They have already destroyed Ramapo and Orange County..

I'm jewish

Milo Maltbie wrote

. I don't expect to crack $2 million in retirement unless my IRAs do WAY better.

I think this might be why you and I and others look at this question differently than someone like Z or PeeTex.

If you make tons of money (and expect to make tons of money in retirement), then there are definite advantages to tax minimization strategies. For people who make a normal amount of money in retirement, the difference between 8% tax and 12% tax is pretty minimal in the grand scheme of things.

Also, it's easy to avoid taxes. Want to avoid income tax? Don't have an income! Want to avoid property taxes? Don't own a house! Want to avoid sales taxes? Don't buy things!

Obviously, people soon find out, as wh says, states (countries, cities) usually tend to figure out ways to get you one way or another. Tough to live without an income & without buying anything. And your landlord or hotel operator will pay property tax if you don't.

JasonWx wrote

.  
 15 is reasonable..have friends that pay close to 35k..
all this will eventually come back to destroy the area

Will it? Or will people in the communities vote for lower taxes if they don't like what the area is becoming? A lot of times, communities use high property tax rates to keep the "riff raff" (read: poor & middle class people) out. I'm assuming that the prices of houses aren't cheap down there. If property tax rates were truly a destructive force, would people pay such high prices to live in the area?

You guys are paying for a thing. If you don't like the terms of that arrangement, you can leave, go to a different place, and get involved in different arrangement.

I pay like $4300 now btwn property and school taxes, two checks, around $2500 now, and around $1800 in January. My house is listed at 1,112 sq. ft.

MC2 5678F589 wrote

I pay like $4300 now btwn property and school taxes, two checks, around $2500 now, and around $1800 in January. My house is listed at 1,112 sq. ft.

I'm guessing you live upstate in a modest, middle-class neighborhood?

That kind of rate is typical for most of suburban and rural NY except for a few really high end towns that tend to accumulate the social elite.  I find those towns very vanilla and boring personally, although the architecture is usually spectacular, and about the only good thing about them.

That and waterfront property - the tax rate depends on county and town, but the assessed values are astronomical, and thus so are the taxes.

Most of upstate NY is pretty poor.

JasonWx wrote

that being said we are being squeeze by Hassic and Orthodox jews who keep trying to buy into Clarkstown. They have already destroyed Ramapo and Orange County..

I'm jewish

Me too!

My wife (not a Jew) often attributes our financial success to my Jewness (not at all stingy, but very thoughtful and deliberate when it comes to deploying financial resources).  I describe myself as an independent conservative; however, I really don't mind paying taxes... especially school taxes.  Until I left my job, we were DINKS.  Our combined income was high six figures.  For the better part of 10 years, nearly my entire salary was paid in federal income tax.  I never complained... and I think that bought me good investment Karma.    

We have no kids.  But I honestly believe public education should be the highest priority of all communities.

You crack me up!!

Cunningstunts wrote

I'm guessing you live upstate in a modest, middle-class neighborhood?

...  I find those towns very vanilla and boring personally, although the architecture is usually spectacular, and about the only good thing about them..

Correct in the first part, correct that it's definitely a boring & vanilla bedroom community, but the architecture of my house is garbage, too (shitty raised ranch). Location & schools are good, though, so I guess that's desirable to people.

Hopefully selling the house at some point, and moving closer to ski areas/mountain biking/nice scenery, etc. At that point, I'll have a list of what I want in a house (more of an "in-town" location, a good sitting porch in the front, maybe a Craftsman style or something, a nice back deck, views, adventure access, maybe a body of water (river or lake), etc.).

This house was just a "I need a place to live while I work my career" house. The next one's gonna be a "this is where I want to spend my life" house, but it may take a few years of renting to pin down a spot.

I work for a christian college..I'm known as the cheap jew in charge..I think it's funny..

The hassi's and orthodox don't send their kids to public schools or buy from local merchants. they try to vote the school budget down every year..I can go on forever.