Alta and NoVT Snow Totals

Harvey wrote

I looked and 2010-11 was huge at Alta 750.  Others in the last 5 years were around 400-450. Hard to believe that sucks, but I guess it does. Certainly takes more to cover things out there.

With Pres Week upon us and a lot of people canceling trips out west to ski here... should be interesting to see the impact on final numbers for the east.

HA! Ok, so way better than I guessed. I was giving them the benefit of the doubt since I have heard so much complaining about the last few years. They sure are spoiled.

But I don't think the quality can be measured by the snowfall total numbers. I wouldn't know for sure but I think there like here we are seeing long periods of very warm air in between cycles. This is having a larger impact on overall quality, base, and avalanche dangers.

In Flag here we are in season 5 of sub par conditions. I'm getting jaded and unwilling to invest much of myself (financially/emotionally) in skiing at this point.

Wasn't calling you out AZ, just wondering.

Here it is:

Allthough the numbers don't really show it, Utah had a tough year last year. To me it is just not worth it to spend that much money on those conditions, when the snow gets baked like it can out there a lot of rocks appear at the higher elevations. The groomers are good for the first half of the day and then they are mash. The off piste and BC gets manky unless you go on the North faces and in the trees. Soft snow avalanche danger goes up. Right now Avi conditions are moderate at high elevations but I would be real worried about Southerly or easterly facing slopes. I have been there on many an epic powder day and I will pay for that, but to waist my time on marginal conditions when things are so good here, why bother. I'm not spoiled, I'm on the east coast where conditions are peachy.

 wow i had no idea that 400 inches could be a lousy winter. we have seen  our fair share of them on the east coast.
i thought they were just whining in SLC because they had to ski packed powder. my apologies  

I had no idea how much snow Alta got or what was considered good or bad until today. I did know they had 800 inches a few years ago and that was all time.  I remember someone telling me that some areas at Alta are unskiable without 80-100 inches.

PeeTex wrote

 but to waist my time on marginal conditions when things are so good here, why bother.

fer sure........today

Damn straight.  Alta's pick of the day has a couple of guys cruising a few inches which is all they got. They are begging and pleading for what we have here right now. They haven't had a good dump in almost a month now. I can only imagine what the low elevation areas are looking like. My wife religiously looks at the Alta pic of the day, there have been a lot of pics of kids, the restaurants, food, license plates on cars, people on the chair lift,  but not those epic powder shots. That's how you can tell what the conditions are like, just look at the pic of the day history, if they can't find anyplace to take an epic powder shot, they take pictures of something else.

I wouldn't count them out..they still have march and april..the snowiest months of the year for them..

I don't think anyone is counting them out, or at least I'm not. My super scientific analysis shows there is a less than 10% chance the season will end this way when Alta closes in April.

i was at alta during winter 82-83 in april with all my spring gear. big mistake. snowed like crazy. had a couple fresh powder days.

sig wrote

 . they need to come see some boilerplate to realize how fortunate they are

But that's what makes we east coast skiers so tuff , not like those wussy west coast skiers

JasonWx wrote

I wouldn't count them out..they still have march and april..the snowiest months of the year for them..

Indeed, I have been there in April and gotten Interlodged due to snow.
No one is counting them out, except Pres week looks like it could be groomers.

Harvey wrote

Wasn't calling you out AZ, just wondering.

Here it is:

 Ya, I didn't read it like that. I threw out a guesstimate and lowballed what I though it actually was just so the Utah folks didn't sound so spoiled but apparently they really are!

We would kill for a 400 inch year here.

I wish I could fly out of here right now to experience the east in all of it's glory again. My last few years out there (20 years ago) were huge but I wasn't half the skier I am now.

I'm curious if this new arctic oscillation pattern is something that is going to happen more often than not. Imagine if Vermont becomes the new go to powder spot. With all of the crowding already out there it might be too much of a good thing. A few more years of this and the ski industries of Lake Tahoe and areas around the four corners region might collapse. I'm guessing the big ski corp people are starting to look at alternatives for profit during the other seasons at this point. Heck, it won't be long before Tahoe won't have water for even making snow.


One from Alta, 1998. Pow skiing on some low pro 215 dh boards.

This is what is so frustrating about planning a western trip.  Last year we hit it just right (February) and had one 18" day (Beaver Mtn.), one 10" day (Solitude), one snow cat trip (~12"-24" depending on run) and one awesome snowmobiling trip into the back country (deep, but not skiing).  Lots of avalanche danger in the b/c though.

Year before it was one 6" day at Alta and one freeze/though day at Brighton.

On both trips I went up to Grand Targhee for a few days; 1st year it was 2 days of X-C (slopes were freeze/thaw) and one 5" day on slopes, second year it was one so-so day then I headed south to SLC where it dumped day after day.

Despite the marketing photos it's not all that different from the northeast -  maybe just better odds at hitting a powder day.

This year...not so good out there.  I have an acquaintance that is there from 2/1-3/1 that has been giving me daily updates - after skiing at PC/Canyons for 10 days he's thinking of heading down to Moab to do some mtn biking this week lol!

onscott wrote

This is what is so frustrating about planning a western trip.

Or any trip. This is really why we built our cabin.

Yeah I know we are tied to one part of the country.  But we were traveling there all the time anyway. We'd wait as long as we could to book a room balancing the weather with lodging availability. Sometimes we couldn't get lodging and sometimes we'd get it and it would rain.

Now, every single week in the winter I "take Friday afternoon off."  If the weather/snow looks good Thursday night, we pack up the car and go.  If it doesn't look good, I just show up on Friday and work the whole day.

I don't really care about variety the way most people do. Gore is huge, Hickory opens occasionally, Garnet Hill has a ton of nordic options, the Siamese Ponds Wilderness is right there, and it's all good in summer too. Plus I can day trip the Cats.  Yeah it's a crapload of driving, but I don't ski when it sucks, unless I really want to.

Well, I'll chime in.

Just took a pre planned trip to Utah from Colorado (Summit County). Plan was to do two days at Alta on the Mountain Collective and two days at Park City/Canyons. Left after the first two days at Alta, now back in Summit. Worst conditions I have ever encountered at Alta Monday. Sleet and ice in the face while skiing ice and death pebbles, even on the top. Cover was good, though. Tuesday was OK, I guess, with four to five on top of death pebbles and ice, until clouds and fog rolled in. We left early because forecast was for record highs in the valley until Sunday. Lord knows how bad the lower Park City is.

That said, even with those conditions, Alta still amazes me. The finest ski mountain in America. A sacred place. Nothing, nothing in the east compares. Sure, maybe the powder is good right now back there, but, really, let's talk in a week when the jet stream gets back to normal. C'mon.

High Colorado is in excellent shape. Great base. Can't breathe, but, altitude keeps the snow nice. We're getting some Monday, they say. Until then, cruising in the sun on edibles.

PeeTex wrote

I'll save up and splurge on a week at the Rustler Lodge next year.

Don't spend your money that way. Stay at the base of the Cottonwood canyons. Last year we were in Draper, this year even better in Cottonwood Heights. Excellent location. Tons of modern hotels at very good prices, excellent Mexican food for cheap, and no interlodge if that happens. We were quoted 385 a night at the Goldminers at the base, if they even had a room. I don't think so, even if a mediocre dinner is included.
It's only fifteen to twenty minutes up the hill.

Benny Profane wrote

..let's talk in a week when the jet stream gets back to normal. C'mon.

I'm finding the "stories" on this kind of ridiculous. TGR had some kind of clickbait on it, when I got to it it was maybe five sentences with yet another POV. (I was hoping for some stats).  The skiing has been really good for about 3 weeks, excellent for the last two.  

That is not that unusual. Halfway through the season Gore is at 85 or 90 inches on a 150 inch annual average. (Just using Gore because I watch it pretty closely).

I love it, but just saying statistically this should happen every now and then.  The incredible thing is that the Jet hasn't moved (much) for that long.  That seems unusual. Also because of it, and the somewhat southerly storm tracks we've had, everyone has gotten some snow, not just NoVT.  Best thing is with the Jet, no setbacks. When was the last one? Too senile to remember.

The other thing it points out is how little snow it takes to make the East go off. Gore has had 23 inches this month. 30 since Jan 25 when this run sorta started (I think).  That's one moderate size storm for Alta.

Benny,
Alta-bird is an incredible place for sure. However, at least for me, if your stuck on the Groomers it sucks after 2 days. If the off piste is mank or crust or rock hard your stuck. I have had incredible times there when they have had no snow the whole time, but the BC and off piste has stayed very skiable, that's usually mid March to mid April though.

As far as lodging, I have stayed up at Alta and the Bird and I have stayed in the Valley. If I want a vacation experience and my wife is along I will stay at one of the three decent lodges at Alta, she can ski half a day and then go to the pool or hot tub and I don't feel guilty. If it's just me, I will stay at the Residence Inn in Sandy or with my friend up by the University.

Oh, well, you didn't mention the all important wife factor. But then I'd stay slope side in Park City.

And, as far as the groomers, all it took was four inches of snow overnight at Alta to make it tolerable on Tuesday off them. Far from great, but, better than anything east of KC. Amazing place. Maybe someday I'll get the snorkel deep again. Gotta be lucky for that.