Gore Conditions (2018 - 2019)

Man power is a problem, minimum wage. No housing , not enough locals, seasonal work.
Your new trail may have promise , may be greenish and create upper and lower glade runs.

My bad, you are right that the current solution only solves part of the problem.

I am in awe of you who can combine topos and satellite and paint programs to outline potential trails.  I think your solution while it cuts through several glades could preserve parts of them. (?)

Tsitsho LOL.

One of the problems with that terrain pod is its hard to get to and even harder to get out of if a race is going on.  A trail thru Cirque does not fix that as it would put you on the wrong side of the end of the race area on Echo.  The real problem here is that Orda tried to connect with the ski bowl on the cheap and do it with one lift where two were really needed given the distances involved.  Pratt must be a X-C skier as he thinks nothing of building enormous flat spots into his trail networks that no other private ski area operator would ever build.  Its not so bad for most of us but imagine the impact to snowboarders or parents with little kids trying to get to BR lift or if you cant / don't ski glades getting out.  

Echo is a good race hill - my son really likes it for Super G but its terrible for parents as there is very few viewing spots - the best requires a pretty big schlep up hill or thru the woods to get to.

The whole thing was not a bad idea but met the fate of most things Orda - it suffers from poor execution due to being too cheap to do it the right way the first time.

PeeTex wrote

The skate on Cedars is not too bad if you bother to wax your skis. The real issue over there is that your in another world, no lodge, no facilities. I think the original idea was to host races over there and get them away from trails needed for general public and for that I think it does pretty well, but that does not make a lot of financial sense.

If Burnt Ridge was finished, it would be nice if they added a warming hut with some restrooms. At the base elevation (1300'), they should be able to add a septic system. But we also watched them take decades to finally add restrooms at the top of Gore and update the restrooms in the Saddle Lodge. Since it is not on any plans, a warming hut at the bottom of Burnt Ridge will never happen. There is a lodge still on the plans for the top of the Gondola on Bear, but seeing how the Gondola is closing in on 20 years old and there is no lodge at the top of Bear, I think we can assume that there will never be a lodge on Bear.

PeeTex wrote

Most likely the reason Gore has not significantly expanded its market is because they have max’d out the day skier market and N Creek doesn’t have any more lodging and no more will be built for a one season destination.

I do not think the lack of lodging is the reason for the lack of skier visit increase. Many skiers in my area (NYC metro) just do not have a good handle on Gore (terrain, size, lifts, snowmaking) or its favorable location to the NYC market. Even people who have heard of Gore think it is much further away than it actually is from NYC.

Gore is NEVER advertised in the NYC metro area. I see ads for Lake Placid/Whiteface on a regular basis (also many individual Catskill and VT ski areas). How does the largest ski area in NYS ignore the NYC market? One of the main reasons for the expansion into Burnt Ridge and the Ski Bowl was to increase skier visits at Gore. Somebody should have to answer for the lack of increase in visits, but since ORDA is such a minor part of the NYS financial situation and a "public" authority, nothing will ever happen to those who are responsible.

Forget about a lodge at Burnt Ridge, if they replaced the North Chair with a high speed detachable quad folks could just run down Hedges and shoot up to the Saddle to warm up.  And with the new trail cut in from Tahawus they could just zip right back.

Forget about a lodge at Bear Mountain, just upgrade the Gondi and send it to the summit and folks could just shoot up to the new summit lodge at the old gondola barn.

And yes, PeeTex nailed it.  If you want to increase skier volume ADVERTISE......I can't even tell you how many times I tell people I'm a ski bum and when I tell them I ski at Gore, they look at me with this blank stare.....Gore?  Where's that?  Is that in New York or Vermont?  etc. etc. etc.  

Build it and they will come does not work in the skiing world.


Oh...and Harvey...that naming...as soon as I saw that in the Mohawk Thesaurus (yes one actually exists), I was wondering how long it would take for someone to put two and two together.....you're sharp my friend, bravo!

MikePom wrote

 Build it and they will come does not work in the skiing world.

Build and they most likely won't, but if you blow it, as in a lot of snow, THEY WILL COME!!! Just ask the "right" Mike, as in Solimano!!

Hey Coach, ever wonder where the phrase "biggest horizontal in the East" came from??

I think this discussion just went full circle?  Didn't it start with a plea to blow?

To me it feels like all is right with the world again.

The Tsitsho is a great idea hopefully Gore management looks at this forum. They could also make a trail off it that heads towards the ski bowl. With respect to snow making I think some of the new capacity is with automated guns hopefully requiring less manpower.

xWeatherMan wrote

The Tsitsho is a great idea hopefully Gore management looks at this forum.

This forum is as great as a day in knee deep POW.

I think it’s trail cutting time.

There are a number of good ideas in this thread. It's too bad no one thought of them when there was an open comment period on the UMP.  ORDA would have had to respond to them.  They might even take them seriously if a group of pass holders, property owners, and local business interests filed comments as a group, and described them in the context of the plan's goals, which include a better experience for advanced skiers.

OTOH judging by the progress made on previous plans, we will have another opportunity to comment before they do anything terrible. ORDA has way more plans than actual accomplishments.

mm

Was up at Gore this weekend, lots of new snow guns in the parking lot. Heard they are installing some automated snowmaking on the lower mountain and off Bear. Also heard they replaced the pipes that had frozen. Looks like they cut out the hump between Ruby & Saddle.

I'm really excited.

PeeTex wrote

Also heard they replaced the pipes that had frozen. Looks like they cut out the hump between Ruby & Saddle.

Sounds like I’m out of the loop (nothing new) Did somebody neglect to drain a line properly?

Milo Maltbie wrote

There are a number of good ideas in this thread. It's too bad no one thought of them when there was an open comment period on the UMP.  ORDA would have had to respond to them.  They might even take them seriously if a group of pass holders, property owners, and local business interests filed comments as a group, and described them in the context of the plan's goals, which include a better experience for advanced skiers.

OTOH judging by the progress made on previous plans, we will have another opportunity to comment before they do anything terrible. ORDA has way more plans than actual accomplishments.

mm

How does this type of activity get better tracked so that if there is opportunity, efforts can be made?

PS...rough math is telling me that if all goes well with mother nature, guns blowing in about 65 days....that's almost impossible to conceive seeing that the thermostat on my Jeep was registering 91 degrees this afternoon.

Whoever engineeres Gores Trail planning/layouts needs a lesson on flowing connectivity.

I get Harvey’s feelings about having a nice high speed chair for skiing glades when there’s snow but from a ski area management perspective they really blew it in the planning process for that expansion.

MikePom wrote

Milo Maltbie wrote

...judging by the progress made on previous plans, we will have another opportunity to comment before they do anything terrible. ORDA has way more plans than actual accomplishments.

mm

How does this type of activity get better tracked so that if there is opportunity, efforts can be made?

Agency actions are published in the State Register every two weeks.  I've been following that for years, but not for ORDA stuff.  

The hard part is putting a group together with similar interest.  I would look for hotel and restaurant owners who don't want Gore to be turned into a low rent Okemo, which is what the UMP seems to allow.

mm

Does anybody know what's up with the gore webcam it seems to be showing images from August I want to see today.

Harvey wrote

Does anybody know what's up with the gore webcam it seems to be showing images from August I want to see today.

Sound like a case of snow fever setting in!  I’m starting to get the chills! ❄️❄️❄️❄️⛷