Killington World Cup in Nov 2016?

I've always thought that when I see some get so excited to ski mud in May. Buy a bike already.

I've got all summer to ride a bike.  I've only got from November to April to ski, so if I can stretch into May, I will.

Benny Profane wrote

I've always thought that when I see some get so excited to ski mud in May. Buy a bike already.

I kind of agree about quality over quantity these days.  But, hell, there wasn't much mud at all in mid-May:





Unless of course, you duck some ropes...but check out that smile!!!

snoloco wrote

Sounds like the FIS is very paranoid about the chance of snow falling on someone.  Just put signs at the bottom that say if anyone knocks snow off their skis or throws a snowball onto the course that they get ejected from the resort without refund and banned from returning for the rest of the season.

They are going 45 -50 mph in a GS and these are World class athletes like Vonn.  Would they let someone go over the playing field of any pro sport? Of course not.

If falling snow is such a concern, then why did they pick Superstar to do this on?  Ovation has no lift running over it and better pitch.  There'd also be more room for a grandstand at the bottom of that trail.

Ovation does not have enough vert to host a WC GS.  .  I also would not film as well.  They picked SS becuase they have no intention of anyone being on that lift.  Give it up already.  It's like arguing with Matt about politics.  I'm right in both.  

I don't know what all the fuss is about.  It's one weekend.  People should be thrilled that a World Cup race will be at Killington.  I'd love to have a World Cup xc race in the northeast US.

How does Ovation not have the same vert as SS?  They're off the same lift and practically right next to each other.  How would it film well if the area looks deserted beyond the race?  If the lift is sitting idle or running empty, that's not going to look as good as if it is running with people on it.  I believe one can see more of Ovation from the bottom while once Superstar gets above the lower part, no one can see anything.  If the lift doesn't open which you seem to think, then one could only see maybe 2 turns.  Why would anyone pay admission to watch that?

snoloco wrote

backlash

Maybe so. To tell you the truth, I have no idea. I know many think K doesn't care too, or whatever.

It is their business, to operate as they think best.  They could also decide to close the place April 15, next spring.

I bet a donut that even with the race K will have more terrain open sooner than anyone else.

If this pisses you off ski somewhere else.

Marcski wrote

This pic FTW.

Harvey wrote

snoloco wrote

backlash

Maybe so. To tell you the truth, I have no idea. I know many think K doesn't care too, or whatever.

It is their business, to operate as they think best.  They could also decide to close the place April 15, next spring.

I bet a donut that even with the race K will have more terrain open sooner than anyone else.

If this pisses you off ski somewhere else.

I'm trying to argue that they should and do care about terrain open to the public, even with the race and explaining that there are plenty of ways to have an excellent race venue without the maddening closures of surrounding trails and lifts.

I recently read that only the slalom race would be on Superstar and GS on Skyehawk/Skyelark.  The slalom course would end before lower SS making the lift crossing issue null and void.  With the Skyehawk/Skyelark route, they could still have a public route open starting on Gateway and going down Bittersweet High Road, to Highlander and back to the bottom.  It wouldn't be the most convenient route, but would allow the public to get up close to the race for some amazing views.  What would be the fun of coming out to watch this if you can't see anything further up from the finish?

snoloco wrote

What would be the fun of coming out to watch this if you can't see anything further up from the finish?

What would be the fun in watching a ski race from along the race course, indeed. Asked no one that has ever had that "pleasure". As a former racer that has also tended gates, there is nothing fun about standing outside in the cold on an inclined slope watching someone speed past you once per minute.

This is a non-issue. Superstar may or may not even open any given year by Thanksgiving depending on temperatures. K will blow the piss out of it early to get it open, they'll need to invest a lot of snow making to deal with inevitable melting. That means as soon as the race is over, skiers and riders will have more terrain available to them post-Thanksgiving than normal.

If you are a skier or rider that loves Killington and wants to ski there during the World Cup and has no interest in the race, then you should make other plans or prepare to be miserable. For those that enjoy the festivities that the race will bring, they will be very happy. For those that enjoy skiing lots of trails in December, K is going to be a great option after the race is held and trails reopen to the GP.

But for race logistics, they'll need to keep the GP off the Superstar lift, IMO. There just won't be good options that wouldn't interfere with the logistics involved in holding a race there that early in the season.

There is no snow making on upper ovation and is rocky and un suatable for racing above the catwalk plus it has an no flat spit at the top for a start area.

I seriously doubt they would have the GS on a different route that results in having to have two finish areas.  That would double the prep work with two sets of grandstands and TV set ups and more than double the snow snow required and the other route you mention is not a full true north aspect.

Superstar isn't certified for GS and is only certified for slalom above 3100 feet.  That is about 600 feet higher than KBL.  Found this on the FIS website.

Minus ONE  Plus ONE


Minus:    Sno---sometimes you have to broaden your thoughts outside your world, or learn to listen.    With all the skiing you have done, you SURELY have seen a-holes on the lift.  Snow falling off skis even happens to people not intending to do so.   Skis fall off, poles drop, gloves drop, people spit and toss or drop energy/beer cans and cell phones. These racers train 365 days for these few races, FIS, Umpires and Judges are already taking tons of chances they cannot control, or have limited control over.   GP on lifts is 100% in their control, they would not take the chance---Just think of the bad press the race and Kmart would get....."WC skier xyz injured as falling cell phone interrupts her line"     This is WC---WC!   If you don't get that, you won't.  


Plus: !   Sno--nice digging on FIS sites to get the facts on SL and GS on SS.  Impressive.  It is good to question authority!  LOL--from above.       I initially agreed with Z about the duel grandstands, but if SS is not GS certified and only  SL certified on the top, I just don't think this race is going to happen at Kmart.     I feel the costs and logistics could be too much even for them, especially knowing they would love the press and advertising boom that can be leveraged for years.  One cannot see the top of SS from the bottom--unless you are way out in the lower parking lot where skiers look like ants. I posted that view on a spring skiing thread.   It would also be a hell of a walk for the public to hike 2/3 up SS to see the SL race.  I am guessing the slope after the headwall is not steep enough over quite a far distance to meet the GS certification.   That said, the headwall seems too short for a WC SL unless they include some of the flatter terrain.     Odd.        


Quickly edited to delete idea that a temp ramp could be built to get unbooted spectators up until the race started..realized after posting that this is a HS quad.  no can do.  Guess they could allow spectators to ride up 60 mins before the race started, where they could walk wide around to the base of the head wall.  
 
         

the other place worthy of a WC race on the east coast is the mighty Whiteface!  this thread is mute!!!!

I:)skiing wrote

Minus:    Sno---sometimes you have to broaden your thoughts outside your world, or learn to listen.    With all the skiing you have done, you SURELY have seen a-holes on the lift.  Snow falling off skis even happens to people not intending to do so.   Skis fall off, poles drop, gloves drop, people spit and toss or drop energy/beer cans and cell phones. These racers train 365 days for these few races, FIS, Umpires and Judges are already taking tons of chances they cannot control, or have limited control over.   GP on lifts is 100% in their control, they would not take the chance---Just think of the bad press the race and Kmart would get....."WC skier xyz injured as falling cell phone interrupts her line"     This is WC---WC!   If you don't get that, you won't.  

I have been hit by snow falling from the lift and it does not feel good.  My dad got hit by an ice ball at Windham a while back.  It came off the main HSQ right near the base so he wasn't going very fast either.

With the slalom certification being where it is, this would be a non issue.  I assume the certification ends at 3,100 feet because of the lack of enough flat space at the bottom for a finish.  It could also be to avoid the lift crossing.


Here is the link in which I found this info.  http://data.fis-ski.com/alpine-skiing/homologations.html?place=Killington%2C+VT&discipline=&nat=&gender=&homid=1396&type=DET§or=&valid=1

I:)skiing wrote

Plus: !   Sno--nice digging on FIS sites to get the facts on SL and GS on SS.  Impressive.  It is good to question authority!  LOL--from above.       I initially agreed with Z about the duel grandstands, but if SS is not GS certified and only  SL certified on the top, I just don't think this race is going to happen at Kmart.     I feel the costs and logistics could be too much even for them, especially knowing they would love the press and advertising boom that can be leveraged for years.  One cannot see the top of SS from the bottom--unless you are way out in the lower parking lot where skiers look like ants. I posted that view on a spring skiing thread.   It would also be a hell of a walk for the public to hike 2/3 up SS to see the SL race.  I am guessing the slope after the headwall is not steep enough over quite a far distance to meet the GS certification.   That said, the headwall seems too short for a WC SL unless they include some of the flatter terrain.     Odd.        

This race is now on the FIS schedule.  It is going to happen at Killington.  They need to use the trails that are certified, so spending extra money on a second grandstand would have to be within the budget.  Killington is going to make a ton of money off of this, so spending money on an extra temporary grandstand shouldn't break the bank.

I:)skiing wrote

Quickly edited to delete idea that a temp ramp could be built to get unbooted spectators up until the race started..realized after posting that this is a HS quad.  no can do.  Guess they could allow spectators to ride up 60 mins before the race started, where they could walk wide around to the base of the head wall.

Just because a lift is high speed doesn't mean it has to run high speed.  The Payday 6-pack at Park City has a summer ramp for the alpine slide with no detach mechanism.  The lift runs 250-300 fpm in the summer and at 1,000 fpm in the winter.  Assuming there is a way to lower a temporary ramp out of where skiers on the lift would hit it, they could have the lift closed to skier traffic for 30 minutes before the race to get people up to the finish area.  Then reopen it at the start of the race.  This all assumes that there is an open public route off the lift.

I was waiting for someone to come out with this.  +1 Scotty Jack.

That doesn't mean they can't get SS certified for GS this winter.  Having to blow that much more snow that early in the season is adding to the risk.

Sno I take it you have never watched a race in person.  I can tell you only the new to racing parents stand on the side of the trail for two hours.  It sucks. I've learned to stand on the flats at the bottom now as a veteran race parent.  Also you can't hear the timing results unless you are at the bottom.  For a WC they will have brought in a potable Jumbotron so you can see the whole run but only from the bottom.  Give it up you don't know everything.  Accepting this is part of wisdom.  

Sno I take it you have never watched a race in person.  I can tell you only the new to racing parents stand on the side of the trail for two hours.  It sucks. I've learned to stand on the flats at the bottom now as a veteran race parent.


This is sooo true!!!  and no matter how well you dress, you still freeze your ass off.